Holy Symbols bonus Damage Question

[DracoSuave]

According to the player of the Druid he asked about this specifically - and was told that the passage in the PHB2 was supposed to be for BONUS damage not EXTRA damage. i.e. Feats that add to damage should need a base damage to add to. Effects that add extra damage on conditional circumstances add the extra damage regardless of intial damage if the conditions are met.

The thing is, there's no 'bonus' damage, other than 'a bonus to damage.' The PHB2 text is pretty clear that it refers to -extra- damage.

 

[Nichwee]

The thing is, there's no 'bonus' damage, other than 'a bonus to damage.' The PHB2 text is pretty clear that it refers to -extra- damage.

I agree. And I wish I could get the Druid to agree - but while he has CS to say "No, feel free to add extra damage to no initial damage" he will stick to doing so as he hates losing his "combo pieces".

 

[DracoSuave]

I agree. And I wish I could get the Druid to agree - but while he has CS to say "No, feel free to add extra damage to no initial damage" he will stick to doing so as he hates losing his "combo pieces".

And if you're the DM of the group, shake your head, and don't toss on the damage. You made your ruling. Just remind him that CS is imperfect, and has made rulings against the rules before. As well, CS always says 'As usual, you're DM is the final arbiter of the game' or some junk like that.

Players don't make the rulings in the game.

 

[Aulirophile]

I believe properties like Earthfall Totem modify the power. If the power does initial damage, it adds to that, even if the targets that are being slid/knocked prone don't usually receive damage from the power. The power as a whole needs to do some initial damage. I've never seen CS contradict themselves on that, and in multiple instances (Crippling Crush with Tremor Slam, Earthfall Totem+Anything, etc.,) they've specifically said it works. The PHB2 wording doesn't exactly contradict that interpretation, either.

And, for what it is worth, both of the Druid handbooks on the official CharOp forum suggest that exact combination. That is basically the only reason to use any Totem instead of a Staff of Ruin (barring Alfsair Spear Polearm Momentum shenanigans).

"Extra" damage always requires initial damage, just not necessarily to the original target of the power, basically. It is confusing.