D&D (2024) (+) Hopes for The Monk

[Bill Zebub]

My hope is that instead of buffing monks using the same things other classes have they find a unique way of doing it that feels different from other classes.

What I still would love love love to see is for monks to be granted extra reactions, and then given some flavorful abilities (offensive, defensive, movement, utility) on which to spend those reactions, both in the base class and the subclasses.

 

[Clint_L]

What about giving monks a spell interrupt? Kind of like mage slayer, where they get a reaction attack if adjacent to an enemy attempting to cast a spell. Except instead of doing damage, the spellcaster has to make a constitution save or the spell is countered. The interrupt is free, but for every ki the monk spends, subtract their proficiency bonus from the enemy's saving throw.

The monk's big thing is maneuverability - they should be charging to the back and making life hell for enemy casters.

 

[James Gasik]

The problem with charging to the back line is when the enemy melee can fall back and surround the Monk, who isn't built to take that kind of pressure for long.

I'm not sure the interruption ability would be super useful or not, they already have Stunning Strike, while a melee counterspell isn't terrible, it only comes up if there is an enemy spellcaster, so there are going to be fights where it's literally a ribbon.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The problem with charging to the back line is when the enemy melee can fall back and surround the Monk, who isn't built to take that kind of pressure for long.

I'm not sure the interruption ability would be super useful or not, they already have Stunning Strike, while a melee counterspell isn't terrible, it only comes up if there is an enemy spellcaster, so there are going to be fights where it's literally a ribbon.

There should be more situational uses of ki.

And the patient defense action should provide passive DR that stacks with deflect missiles (which should work for any weapon attack).

And step of the wind shouldn’t be the only way to more easily disengage and get out of that surrounded situation.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I wonder if you could just replace stunning strike with upgrades to the non-ki abilities.

Like, Unarmored movement: When you are targeted by an attack of opportunity, you can use an extra 5ft of movement to impose disadvantage on the attack. (No action required)

Martial Arts: when you make an attack with an unarmed strike, you can choose to deal damage and try to grapple, slow, or shove the target. If you spend 1 ki, you can instead deal damage and try to daze, disarm, or silence, the target.

 

[shadowoflameth]

So, first thing, it’s a plus thread. Discussion is good, crapping on people’s ideals, petty bickering, and arguing that the monk shouldn’t exist or shouldn’t be updated or that OneDnD is bad and we should feel bad, are all not it.

That said, I have some hopes for the monk, and I’m curious what everyone else’s are.

• New name - I doubt this will happen, but mystic or adept are both good alternatives to monk
• Renamed Ki to focus, spirit, energy, anything but ki or exertion
• A clean way to regain extra ki* to effectively give more ki without changing the numbers on the class table or the max you can have going into a scene, like regain wisdom mod ki as an action PB/LR
• More ki features, less hard focus on being Unarmored and unarmed.
  • Unarmored Defense like the Barbarian, no features only working if Unarmored, flurry of blows and the martial arts attack deal set damage dice but don’t have to be unarmed attacks. Flavor can be pommel strikes or even just quick jabs with the weapon, etc.
• Add a mystical power attack that just adds force damage to a successful attack.
• Stunning strike dazed target, and the target becomes stunned if you use it on them again while they are dazed. Or replace it entirely with a set of upgrades to each of the level 2 ki abilities.
• High level step of the wind allows you to exceed your movement for the round with a jump, and/or gives a short burst fly speed.
• Add a feat of strength ability
• Add fighting styles, with multiple that do not require a weapon
• Maybe have a choice from 3 Forms or whatever at level 1, like the cleric’s Holy Orders. Here you choose whether to be totally unarmed and Unarmored, or to have a specially bonded weapon, or to have more skills?

And the PHB subclasses:

• Open Hand is mostly perfect as is
• Shadow gains 1/LR free use of each leveled spell it gains, teleport at level 3 that scales with levels and gain the advantage rider at level 6
• Elements takes the elemental attunement features of the Wu Jen mystic from UA, gains pb/lr free casting of certain elemental spells, and disciplines drop down by 1 ki each in cost.

The names of things are not the problem. Monk is a good thematic name and distinct from the cleric. I'm not clear on the objection to Ki or Chi which are referenced often in literature and in Martial Arts which the Monk centers around.

For me, Give the Monk a fighting style at 1st. Unarmed would fix the weakness most see in damage output. Drop the Ki point requirement for things that don't warrant it, Step of the Wind and Careful Defense don't need it. Stunning Strike is strong but it often doesn't work. Most Monks don't have a high Save DC on it because of MAD.

WotC should stop it with the poorly made and weak sub classes. Stunning Strike is not a valid justification for offering useless options.

All three PHB sub-classes need help and so do all of the others in later books. The Open Hand is arguably the strongest but there is nothing in it, or any other 5e Monk that can't be done better with a fighter especially if feats are in except Stunning strike.

At 3rd level and beyond, players discover that there simply are no strong sub-class choices and that most options give the character things that are sub-par compared to what the Monk can already do. 4 Elements is the worst in the PHB (maybe in the game) in this regard and it needs a lot more help than just lowering the Ki cost.

 

[Corinnguard]

So, first thing, it’s a plus thread. Discussion is good, crapping on people’s ideals, petty bickering, and arguing that the monk shouldn’t exist or shouldn’t be updated or that OneDnD is bad and we should feel bad, are all not it.

That said, I have some hopes for the monk, and I’m curious what everyone else’s are.

• New name - I doubt this will happen, but mystic or adept are both good alternatives to monk
• Renamed Ki to focus, spirit, energy, anything but ki or exertion
• A clean way to regain extra ki* to effectively give more ki without changing the numbers on the class table or the max you can have going into a scene, like regain wisdom mod ki as an action PB/LR
• More ki features, less hard focus on being Unarmored and unarmed.
  • Unarmored Defense like the Barbarian, no features only working if Unarmored, flurry of blows and the martial arts attack deal set damage dice but don’t have to be unarmed attacks. Flavor can be pommel strikes or even just quick jabs with the weapon, etc.
• Add a mystical power attack that just adds force damage to a successful attack.
• Stunning strike dazed target, and the target becomes stunned if you use it on them again while they are dazed. Or replace it entirely with a set of upgrades to each of the level 2 ki abilities.
• High level step of the wind allows you to exceed your movement for the round with a jump, and/or gives a short burst fly speed.
• Add a feat of strength ability
• Add fighting styles, with multiple that do not require a weapon
• Maybe have a choice from 3 Forms or whatever at level 1, like the cleric’s Holy Orders. Here you choose whether to be totally unarmed and Unarmored, or to have a specially bonded weapon, or to have more skills?

And the PHB subclasses:

• Open Hand is mostly perfect as is
• Shadow gains 1/LR free use of each leveled spell it gains, teleport at level 3 that scales with levels and gain the advantage rider at level 6
• Elements takes the elemental attunement features of the Wu Jen mystic from UA, gains pb/lr free casting of certain elemental spells, and disciplines drop down by 1 ki each in cost.

Adept | Level Up This is what the Adept class from Level Up has to offer. Does it come close to what you want to see for the Monk in One D&D? curious

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Adept | Level Up This is what the Adept class from Level Up has to offer. Does it come close to what you want to see for the Monk in One D&D? curious

I dislike its name, the exertion mechanic, the fact it leans harder toward “martial arts expert” and away from “mystic warrior”, etc. tbh I mostly just am not into the general style and vibe of A5e, is probably the real issue.

That all said, if you took that and made it more mystical, and kept the brawlers and other non-mystic types in the fighter and Barbarian (there really should be a bareknuckle brawler Barbarian, anyway), maybe even put the kensei type into the rogue, and just go all in on “this is a warrior from an esoteric/mystical school” and lean into the actual point of ki in martial arts, which is that all movement and action is rooted in your breath, regardless of whether you’re a fighter, athlete, singer, or whatever else, it’s not a bad start.

Which is why my mystic has focus dice (combined martial arts die and ki points), with the flavor of focus being centered on your breath, and you have techniques ranging from manuevers to stances to meditations, and then “regimens” which are class features you choose during a long rest, activating a small number from a larger pool that you know.

Also, for me, the archetype begs to be able to go to a master of a school and learn a new technique, like a wizard learning a new spell, so techniques and regimens both work that way, with a limit to how many you have prepared via conditioning and focusing on certain aspects of training.

 

[cwallach]

The monk gets a bonus action attack without needing a feat, and has two reactions, Deflect Missile and Slow Fall. I'd like to see more reactions added to the base monk class, such the Defensive Duelist feat. Adding to the action economy would make the monk play differently than other martials.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The monk gets a bonus action attack without needing a feat, and has two reactions, Deflect Missile and Slow Fall. I'd like to see more reactions added to the base monk class, such the Defensive Duelist feat. Adding to the action economy would make the monk play differently than other martials.

PB/LR extra reactions would be cool, once per round, would be cool. Especially if they also make deflect missiles into deflect attacks.