Hordes of the Abyss.

[Imruphel]

Thanks for posting your review. I presume that you will give it a score of 4?

It sounds like an interesting product notwithstanding the strange design decision with respect to the CRs.

 

[Sammael]

Chapter 5 sounds fantastic indeed and probably worth the cover price alone.

Now, about those mini hints: are there any?!?

 

[James Jacobs]

With the knowledge that FC1's Demon Lords will be powered down from their counterparts in the Dragon Articles, will we ever get to see treatment of Grazzt, Orcus and Demogorgon in the pages of Dragon? I must say, the power levels in Dragon and the amount of information there is perfect. I would be deeply disappointed to see the 3 most famous demon lords (And my favorites) get less treatment than some lesser known ones. So hopefully they will be appearing in the not too distant future.

Erik or James, any chance to comment?

The Demonomicon articles will continue to run in Dragon, more or less in the same format as they have been. For those seeking tougher, CR 25+ versions of the demon lords, this is where they'll be detailed. It's of course too early to reveal who's going to get the treatment in the future (or even who's next in the series) but demon lords like Demogorgon, Orcus, and Graz'zt are certainly in the running for Demonomicon articles.

 

[Zarnam]

James, if you're still here, could you tell me one thing about the future Demonomicons - I know it's kind of a spoiler question, but I would be vary grateful for answering it - will the "power limit" or better "CR" of the most powerful demon exceed 30 ?? Another form of this question is - will Demogorgon keep his 30 CR ??

Thanks !!

 

[James Jacobs]

James, if you're still here, could you tell me one thing about the future Demonomicons - I know it's kind of a spoiler question, but I would be vary grateful for answering it - will the "power limit" or better "CR" of the most powerful demon exceed 30 ?? Another form of this question is - will Demogorgon keep his 30 CR ??

Thanks !!

The Demonomicon demon stat blocks will hover around CR 24 to CR 32 or thereabouts. Some might go lower, some higher. In other words, if I do a Demogorgon Demonomicon, his CR may or may not be changing. It's too early to say.

 

[Nightfall]

I do hope (and I admit that I've not read Joe's review yet... Want to be a little surprised and hopeful after some of the disappointing news) that there is at least a new, accurate, and (gods help us) cool picture of Demogorgon, the true Prince of Demons (sorry, Nightfall, but Orcus is not Demogorgon ).

Yeah well Demogorgon isn't Orcus either. Anyway you heretics worship what you want, we all know who rules the Undead.

*is hearted by the fact Orcus might yet get a Demononmicon Article* Still wish they'd use a different art piece. The Graz'zt one is fine. But Orcus needs better art.

 

[RichGreen]

Or, even better yet, dont ever, ever, ever mention the phlogiston again!

Phlogiston! Phlogiston! Phlogiston!

I loved Spelljammer (although I agree that crystal spheres and the phlogiston were a bit silly. Oh, and the dohwar were too).

Anyway, back on topic -- shame that we don't get a new "fat, bloated Orcus" picture. I don't like the BoVD image either.

What CR do you think the klurichir really is now that the balor has been toughened up ? I quite like them, although not as much as the myrmixicus. Used this in an epic campaign where the PCs had to sneak into Abysm and retrieve the Sceptre of Good from one of Demogorgon's vaults.

Cheers


Richard

 

[zoroaster100]

My personal preference is for demon lords to have CRs of 24 to 30 or so, so that a party of 21st to 22nd level can just barely hope to defeat one if the players are prepared and do everything right (and maybe have a strong ally or two). Having said that, the rest of the book sounds pretty useful. I'm looking forward to it. And I'm very glad that Dragon will continue to put out Demonomicon articles about the major demon lords with higher stats and more detailed info.

 

[danir]

Aarrrgh,
I want this books, but demon lords CR's of 20-23... I don't care about not using all the stuff in the book, but this is just.. bad. and no new edition until 4th.
I mean, putting the lords at 22-26 area would still have enabled 18th-20th level ppl to kill some lords, and even the strongest if they are smart. and it would have been a challange. cause CR20 is just not a biggie for 20th level characters.

Shame.
Please, at FC2 nudge up the CR's by a couple of ranks...

 

[Baron Opal]

I'd be willing to gamble that we will have a Demogorgon Demononomicon article in about 12-15 months. Coincidentally, probably around the end of the next AP...