How do you have a mentor travel with a group of PC's and NOT steal their spotlight?
- Thread starter magnusmalkus
- Start date
Another option is to have one of the mentor's "adversaries" show up with a bunch of lower level hirelings.
That way the mentor tells the PCs to handle the hirelings and he'll take care of the big bad guy. Then scoot the heavy hitters off to the side and rather then rolling dice just make periodic references to how the mentor's combat (or spell duel, etc.) is going while the party keeps the main focus of the fight.
That way depending on how the PCs are doing, you can always help them out or have them help their mentor out with a vastly more powerful bad guy....
Heck you can use this combat to have the mentor to be wounded/infected or whatever plot thread you want to throw into the mix.
Oh and it also might give them a preview of who they will eventually be up against. And gives you an excuse to have the big bad get an idea of the tactics the party might use, so that you can play him/her/it smart, and really worry the party.
That way the mentor tells the PCs to handle the hirelings and he'll take care of the big bad guy. Then scoot the heavy hitters off to the side and rather then rolling dice just make periodic references to how the mentor's combat (or spell duel, etc.) is going while the party keeps the main focus of the fight.
That way depending on how the PCs are doing, you can always help them out or have them help their mentor out with a vastly more powerful bad guy....
Heck you can use this combat to have the mentor to be wounded/infected or whatever plot thread you want to throw into the mix.
Oh and it also might give them a preview of who they will eventually be up against. And gives you an excuse to have the big bad get an idea of the tactics the party might use, so that you can play him/her/it smart, and really worry the party.
Inconsequenti-AL
Breaks Games
I'd make him more of a bookish sage than a typical war wizard.
Make him a mostly non combatant wizard. Low concentration score, not (m)any combat spells, weak physical stats (age penalties?), no combat focused magical gear, etc.
Perhaps he has sworn an oath not to use his magic on unwilling creatures? - can get a few buffs out of him, possibly a carefully placed battlefield control spell - but that's going to be about it...
Make him a mostly non combatant wizard. Low concentration score, not (m)any combat spells, weak physical stats (age penalties?), no combat focused magical gear, etc.
Perhaps he has sworn an oath not to use his magic on unwilling creatures? - can get a few buffs out of him, possibly a carefully placed battlefield control spell - but that's going to be about it...
Gold Roger
First Post
Make the NPC's power a tool to create adventures and situations you usually couldn't do. Done right, the NPC might not replace the PC's, but rather, he's a powerfull weapon.
examples:
Scyscribes/Fajitas storyhour recently had a well done passage where the PC's fight alongside a far more powerfull NPC archmage and where still instrumental.
Last session I played in, we had to destroy a lich and where accompanied by a uber NPC. The uber NPC went and defeated the lich, but was teleported away in the process of stage. We then had to figure out that the lich has a philactery, find it and destroy it before the lich regenerated (this was an especially fast rejuvenating species). The uber NPC beat the baddy, but the actual defeat came through the PC's.
The old Against the Cult of the reptile God module has a more powerful wizard accompanying the PC's. But instead of defeating the BBEG singlehandetly, he neutralises his powerfull magic, so the PC's can take him down.
The manga naruto has the young main characters travel along with their far more powerfull mentor, but still manages to showcase the young characters:
In the first combat, the mentor fights an equal opponent and at one point becomes trapped. The young pupils are adviced to run away, but instead figure out how to free they mentor, leading to the opponents defeat.
In another fight, the mentor confronts the equal opponent, while the main characters fight the opponents own equally young, but brilliant pupil.
Also, not every NPC needs to be as combat centered as PC's tend to be. Remember, PC's are build and prepare spells to pretty much always be ready for an all out combat and focus way more on offensive than most people really would. A real high level wizard will keep more defensive and utility spells prepared than right out combat spells, even when going on a trip through dangerous terrain.
You can have combats where the mentor holds off the opposition, while the PC's need to fullfill some task, fights where the NPC is out of spells, fights where the NPC's abilities are negated, fights where the NPC needs all his power to negate one opponent/one opponents powers, fights where the NPC bears the brunt, but the PC's need to make one crittical intervention and fights where the PC's are simply wawy from the mentor on some errant.
examples:
Scyscribes/Fajitas storyhour recently had a well done passage where the PC's fight alongside a far more powerfull NPC archmage and where still instrumental.
Last session I played in, we had to destroy a lich and where accompanied by a uber NPC. The uber NPC went and defeated the lich, but was teleported away in the process of stage. We then had to figure out that the lich has a philactery, find it and destroy it before the lich regenerated (this was an especially fast rejuvenating species). The uber NPC beat the baddy, but the actual defeat came through the PC's.
The old Against the Cult of the reptile God module has a more powerful wizard accompanying the PC's. But instead of defeating the BBEG singlehandetly, he neutralises his powerfull magic, so the PC's can take him down.
The manga naruto has the young main characters travel along with their far more powerfull mentor, but still manages to showcase the young characters:
In the first combat, the mentor fights an equal opponent and at one point becomes trapped. The young pupils are adviced to run away, but instead figure out how to free they mentor, leading to the opponents defeat.
In another fight, the mentor confronts the equal opponent, while the main characters fight the opponents own equally young, but brilliant pupil.
Also, not every NPC needs to be as combat centered as PC's tend to be. Remember, PC's are build and prepare spells to pretty much always be ready for an all out combat and focus way more on offensive than most people really would. A real high level wizard will keep more defensive and utility spells prepared than right out combat spells, even when going on a trip through dangerous terrain.
You can have combats where the mentor holds off the opposition, while the PC's need to fullfill some task, fights where the NPC is out of spells, fights where the NPC's abilities are negated, fights where the NPC needs all his power to negate one opponent/one opponents powers, fights where the NPC bears the brunt, but the PC's need to make one crittical intervention and fights where the PC's are simply wawy from the mentor on some errant.
Imagicka
Explorer
Greetings...
Well, that's the trick eh? Question is, why is a high level... mentor doing with a bunch of low-level peons? Why does he want to explore this cave? Why isn't he exploring it on his own? Why does he need the party? Probably the easiest way is to make that person a 'sage'. Don't give them any spell-casting levels. Make them an expert.
Or you could make it obvious for the players why he has 'hired' the party. Here's a couple of ideas... Make your high-level mentor loose all of his magickal abilities in a freak accident. Or he cast disjunction, and now his powers are gone. Or that he's sick... been poisoned... with a rare disease, or a magical poison that will cost him dearly if he casts high-level magick spells.
Just because it's cliché doesn't mean that it doesn't make for a good story. -- Imagine if you will inquisitors who can sense and hunt down high-level magick. That are just waiting for someone to cast a spell over 3rd level, and their hounds will pick up the scent of magick. -- Perhaps both... he's been poisoned, and now the poisoners are hunting him down with their magick-sniffing hell-hounds.
There's an idea... your high-level wizard has been poisoned by a rival. Perhaps another guild member. Now, this villain couldn't just outright confront our wizard, either because he'd be breaking the code of the guild, or just outright get his hat handed to him, in a fair fight. So, he had him poisoned. Perhaps looking to rob him of his magickal powers, so he could gloat over it while he's sticking the knife in. Thing is the poison didn't completely do it's job. Or our wizard was able to do something to keep himself alive, but now his magickal ability is either crippled... or is wild.
Perhaps the symptoms are changing. He can cast low-level spells, but it usually knocks him unconscious, or causes the spells to be cast as wild-magick. Any high-level spells he casts speeds up the poison's effects, killing him.
He believes that the solution to his problem lies in this dungeon, yet the only people who he could find to help him are these poor souls. His enemy has learned of his expedition, and has sent out assassins to hunt him down and kill him. They don't know exactly where he is, but they do have a means to detect mid-level to high-level magick. One spell that's 4th level or higher, and they will be on him like an illithid on Stephen Hawking.
This would nicely explain why a high-level character would be hanging out with the party of peons. Why there is a sense of urgency, as well as why the wizard can't be flinging fireballs around like it's independance day.
Well, that's the trick eh? Question is, why is a high level... mentor doing with a bunch of low-level peons? Why does he want to explore this cave? Why isn't he exploring it on his own? Why does he need the party? Probably the easiest way is to make that person a 'sage'. Don't give them any spell-casting levels. Make them an expert.
Or you could make it obvious for the players why he has 'hired' the party. Here's a couple of ideas... Make your high-level mentor loose all of his magickal abilities in a freak accident. Or he cast disjunction, and now his powers are gone. Or that he's sick... been poisoned... with a rare disease, or a magical poison that will cost him dearly if he casts high-level magick spells.
Just because it's cliché doesn't mean that it doesn't make for a good story. -- Imagine if you will inquisitors who can sense and hunt down high-level magick. That are just waiting for someone to cast a spell over 3rd level, and their hounds will pick up the scent of magick. -- Perhaps both... he's been poisoned, and now the poisoners are hunting him down with their magick-sniffing hell-hounds.
There's an idea... your high-level wizard has been poisoned by a rival. Perhaps another guild member. Now, this villain couldn't just outright confront our wizard, either because he'd be breaking the code of the guild, or just outright get his hat handed to him, in a fair fight. So, he had him poisoned. Perhaps looking to rob him of his magickal powers, so he could gloat over it while he's sticking the knife in. Thing is the poison didn't completely do it's job. Or our wizard was able to do something to keep himself alive, but now his magickal ability is either crippled... or is wild.
Perhaps the symptoms are changing. He can cast low-level spells, but it usually knocks him unconscious, or causes the spells to be cast as wild-magick. Any high-level spells he casts speeds up the poison's effects, killing him.
He believes that the solution to his problem lies in this dungeon, yet the only people who he could find to help him are these poor souls. His enemy has learned of his expedition, and has sent out assassins to hunt him down and kill him. They don't know exactly where he is, but they do have a means to detect mid-level to high-level magick. One spell that's 4th level or higher, and they will be on him like an illithid on Stephen Hawking.
This would nicely explain why a high-level character would be hanging out with the party of peons. Why there is a sense of urgency, as well as why the wizard can't be flinging fireballs around like it's independance day.
Last edited:
lukelightning
First Post
I say: Kick the mentor out.
D&D is a game with some story elements, not a story. Just because Gandalf and Frodo travelled together doesn't mean that you should have some high level wizard tagging along with the party. And I say wizard because nine times out of ten the mentor is some super powerful wizard.
D&D is a game with some story elements, not a story. Just because Gandalf and Frodo travelled together doesn't mean that you should have some high level wizard tagging along with the party. And I say wizard because nine times out of ten the mentor is some super powerful wizard.
diaglo
Adventurer
check out Peter McNicol before he did Ally Mc Beal... he did Dragonslayer the Movie.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082288/
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082288/
Voadam
Legend
magnusmalkus said:
Wizards are wise to bring along muscle, they are very vulnerable on their own. Known and prepared spells can matter a lot on a wizard's power. A diviner can know a ton of noncombat spells and plausibly want a party to come along to handle combats. Similarly he can have a bunch of personal defensive spells (shield, mirror image, displacement, fire shield, mislead, etc.) that keep him alive but don't really help the party get the adventuring done.
lukelightning
First Post
Voadam said:
So the PCs go from being the main characters of the game to henchmen for the DMs pet NPC. Woot woot!
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