D&D 5E How to create a 3-way fight?

[Not a Hobbit]

I had an encounter with an ogre and 2 owlbears. The ogre had an elk carcass, and the owlbears were trying to take it away from him. If the owlbears kill the ogre, they then go after the party. If the party help the ogre against the owlbears, then the ogre is prepared to defend his kill against the party.The party can fight the ogre or let it take its prize and be on its way.

 

[aco175]

What about having traps. Not great for outdoors on a road, but could make it work. Traps are like undead zombies where they just go off and do not care who is in the way. PCs are fighting a ogre and some crossbow constructs come along and attack everyone. Maybe a secret mage NPC is hiding behind them. Make sure you have the ogre attack one if it gets close to show fairness.

 

[discosoc]

It doesn't really work, in my experience. Not with 5e, anyway. CR balancing isn't actually that hard with it (assuming all sides hate each other equally, you can safely just double the total number of opponents). The problem is that you're adding a bunch of potential complexity to the encounter that the players really can't interact with. They just sit back and wait for you to resolve things.

What I've found works best for 3+ groups fighting (together or independently) is to simply narrate as much as possible as background noise. Here's a few examples:

1. The group is traveling with an old ranger guide and encounters an orc warband. Now many GM's would treat this as a two-sided encounter (and it could be run that way), but I'd opt to simply narrate that the ranger breaks off to fight a few of the orcs while the remaining charge the group. When combat is finished, it's assumed the ranger did just as well as the players.

2. The group is traveling alone and encounters a standoff between two small bandit groups arguing over an overturned cart. As they arrive, the group hears the bandit leaders "agree to a truce until they deal with the intruders" but it's clear the two bands are going to be just as focused on each other as they are on the adventurers. The fight breaks out and the GM narrates the inter-bandit attacks, but otherwise states that the group is simply facing off against the remaining bandits not looking to backstab their competitors.

Basically, that method of 'narrative over mechanics' works really well for handling multi-sided battles without impacting the actual gameplay at all. Anything more detailed (resolving via dice rolls) simply bogs the encounter down with no real benefit to the players.

 

[Quickleaf]

So, I would like to create a 3-way fight. Assuming that the players are a group of goodies, and the first NPCs are mostly evil monsters. What should the 3rd group consist of, so that they will be equally motivated to fight both the players and the other NPCs?

Are there monsters of similar alignments (i.e. evil) who just hate each other passionately, and will always fight each other?

I know that for example a Roper is a monster that will just eat everything, good and evil, so if it would slither into range of an ongoing fight, it would attack both sides, and both sides would attack it, as well as each other. So, that would be a possibility. However, Ropers live in caves, and the scenario is currently above-ground (although that can be changed). I'd like to have more options. Also, I don't like Ropers.

Attacked by goblins! However, half the goblins (the ones with stag antlers on their helmets) hold back during the charge, minimizing their risks by slinging stones and shooting bows. Morale breaks, and both groups flee in different directions, maybe some token violence between the two groups of goblins as they retreat. An existing feud/rivalry has just turned violent, however both groups still intend to prove their worth to the goblin king be capturing (McGuffin/NPC/the PCs themselves).

At the next suitable ambush site, the goblins launch two ambushes. The stag-helmet clan ambushes just the PCs from trees/cliffs or maybe a collapsing bridge, while the other embittered and bloody clan ambushes BOTH PCs and the stag-helmet clan using some kind of poorly-trained critter (e.g. giant spider / worg / owlbear whose nest they disturbed) that could conceivably attack anyone.

Good luck!

 

[Chryssis]

My immediate reaction to two groups that hate each other would be vampires and werewolves... or just two opposing groups -warring clans etc.

 

[Storyteller Hero]

I once had the PCs fighting against Drow raiders in the Underdark, and their fighting attracted a purple worm, which proceeded to gobble up anyone it could reach.

 

[Caliban]

The good, the bad, and the hungry.

 

[ScaleyBob]

I have a couple of different three-way fights here:

Monkey Business
Frigga's Lament

In the first, two monsters - a t-rex and a giant ape - fight each other amidst the PCs trying to save someone. So damage is basically incidental unless the PCs draw attention to themselves in particular ways. In the latter, the remorhazes are simply hunting and don't have much care whether they barbecue PCs, the yeti, or the deva.

The tricky thing in my view is how to pull off a three-way fight with a minimal amount of monsterbating (DM rolling against DM) without that becoming tiresome or stealing spotlight from the players. One solution is to make sure a three-way fight involves only a few monsters.

They're both brilliant. I did a similar to Monkey Business 4 way fight in 4th Ed - a giant Monkey, several T-Rexes, and an Orcish Big Game Hunter who was trying to take down the Monkey. The PCs job was to protect the Monkey, even though it didn't really need protecting, and it viewed the PCs as potential threats. Mostly it was an excuse to have King Kong show up, and throw T-Rexes at my players. (Fey Ray. That's a truly fantastic name. )

As for the original question, there's any number of possibilities - PCs run into some bandits, the noise made by the fight draws in a Bulette, or some Ankhegs, or the smell of blood draws in a wyvern, Manticore or Dragon, who then attacks everyone. The PCs get ambushed by one group of Humanoids only to have a worse group roll up and attack both - ambushed by Orcs or Goblins, and then get attacked by Gnolls or Bugbears. Or maybe have a large group of Baddies (gnolls are good for this) who have a tendency to infight - as the fight progresses, the enemies start attacking one another as well as the PCs over imagined slights, or loot, or captives, or if the single unifying leader gets killed (which can happen quite easily, as PCs almost always target the leader first) the different lieutenants and their followers divide up and attack each other as well as the PCs.

To minimise Monsterbating (great term ), standardize the numbers needed to hit each other (say between 12-15) rather than using a modifier, and use the average damage instead of rolling. Or just wing it.

I'm currently trying to work out a three way fight myself - between the PCs, an Ilithid Psion and it's followers, and a Hobgoblin Wizard Ghost and it's followers. So far, it's looking like it may end up in the too hard basket. Mid level NPC spellcasters are tricky enough when there's one of them, never mind having two attacking each other as well the the Party.

 

[GMMichael]

Whoa whoa whoa. Three-way fights don't happen. Here's why (with emphasis):

Attacking a third party increases your opposition, while allying with a third party effectively decreases your opposition.

It's better just to sit the fight out or flee if you can't do either of the above. Interestingly, whenever I help out some poor bandit in Skyrim when he's being mauled by an ice troll, he still wants to fight me afterward anyway...

 

[Dragonkobold]

I'm currently aiming for an intermezzo-fight: something that happens in the middle of the road, and is not too much tied in to the big story. So, I'd rather leave out any complex politics, which is why I am asking for more general attitudes of monsters.

For example, the party is walking down a road, and an ogre comes running towards them. Ogres aren't part of the story, but any self-respecting adventurer would see the Ogre as an enemy. The party's first thought may be "Oh, cool, an ogre, let's kill it". Then a few seconds later, a group of some other monsters comes crashing into the fight, as they were chasing the Ogre. And now everybody is fighting everybody. The players win (hopefully), and continue their quest to kill the princess and save the dragon (or whatever).

Yup, just kill the princess to save a dragon. Sure, that would be fun to dm.