How to Deal with a difficult DM?

[Impeesa]

NOTE: This not a poke at Tilla, but I am always baffled by the "this is the only game in town, so I play" mindset. To anyone who can find a bad game but not a good one, I always wonder, "So why aren't YOU running a good one?"

Thankfully, my current DM and I think alike, and get on quite well. But if I were stuck in a bad game, I could probably answer that question quite easily: unlike the hypothetical bad DM, I am well aware that my DMing skills are far too rusty to do much better, and I wouldn't want to subject other people to that.

--Impeesa--

 

[S'mon]

As a difficult DM, I find that bribing me with good pizza works well...

 

[Gizzard]

What constitutes bad DMing?

For me it's when I leave a game session and say to myself, "I'm not having fun".

There are lots of reasons why a player might not have fun; not all of which are under control of the DM.

When a player isn't having fun, it's a sign that something is wrong, but it could mean anything from the DM is an incompetent melagalomaniac to the player being an over-sensitive munchkin. Or 100 other things.

If you feel your DM is bad, take a step back and see if you are the only one in your group who feels this way. If you are, take that as a warning sign and ask yourself if there is something *you* can do to improve the gaming experience for everyone.

OTOH, if other people feel the same way that you do, then talking to your DM may help. Even here, if you don't have a specific and achievable improvement in mind then this is probably a waste of time. Bad: "We think you suck and would like you to stop sucking." Better: "We think you are disorganized, and think we'd all have more fun if you read the module before you ran it."

 

[wedgeski]

3. Leave. Bad roleplaying is much, much worse than no roleplaying,and your lack of fun will drain fun from others having fun.

I don't agree with this. Bad roleplaying at least indicates a degree of effort and involvement on the part of the players, and bad roleplaying can be improved; it's much harder to get someone to start roleplaying in the first place.

Edit: if that is, in fact, what you meant. On re-reading I don't think so.

 

[Zappo]

I've played with some very bad DMs.
Pet NPCs (including a sentient, invincible giant rat).
Obvious railroading.
Deliberate misapplication of the rules (the latest one was in star wars d20, where some droids apparently can do AoOs with ranged weapons, shoot with both their weapons as a partial action, or shoot you while grappling instead of making a grapple check... unless they are PC droids, of course).
Blind application of patently stupid rules.
Inventing new equipment of powers that are about ten times as powerful as what the manual describes as "the most powerful weapon ever devised".
Handing out excessive amounts of treasure.
Handing out excessive amounts of XP.
Introducing characters and elements from the latest cool manga/movie/whatever regardless of what we are actually playing.
Needless fudging of rolls and NPC stats (ie, cheating).
Killing the campaign every month or so.
Telling everyone to make complex and well-detailed characters because we're going for a long-running, deep-roleplaying game, and then killing the campaign after a month or so.

And still I've never walked away from the game or the campaign. I'm a pathetic RPG addict.

I've been guilty of several of those during my DMing career, and it took me years to get rid of all of them. The trick is to admitting to it in the first place. Once the truth is firmly in place in the DM's head, everything will improve.

 

[Shallown]

I've disagreed with a GM's style before and left the game. His style and mine were just to different. Sad thing was I liked the GM and liked my fellow players. I woud have loved running a game with them but the GM, only Gmed and wasn't interested in playing which was the only solution that anyone suggested. I communicated my unhappiness openly and honestly and with no malice since I had none but the Gm was as stuck in his ways as I was mine. So I left the group and it took me a while to find a new group. I still have more a madness about the whole matter than any animosity.

I think the whole relationship boils down to honesty and trust. If you don't at least bring up your problems/objections then you are as big a part of the problem as the GM. So far this has worked out for me even though I have lost players and Groups due to it.

Later

 

[Cerubus Dark]

I don't know, I used to be real bad about railroading my PC's, then again when I started in Second edition all I had to use was the premade quests. I didn't start really letting my PC's "do their own thing" for about a year after I started. I found it kind of hard to plan for some of the wacky things they would do. Of course I was also a sadistic monster as well, I used to have a "Random Wish" roll that was done when a player would repeatedly say the phrase "I wish..." That lead to my little brother being very careful about saying such things in the future.

Of course as time went on and thrid edition came out I started planing my world, Building a larger picture and letting the PC's change the out come of the painting. Of course now I am getting bored of my old Homebrew setting and plan on having a world ending catalysm (sp?) that will end the current world, but toss the PC's into a fresh setting, of course they will try to stop it being heros and all, but this setting is doomed.

 

[The_Gneech]

This is a classic psychological problem called blaming the victim.

Top ten Reasons you can be stuck in a crappy game:

8) You like to play instead of GMing. Perhaps you don't have the time to GM.

9) You already GM a game, but you would also like to play in one.

Well heck, I like to play instead of GMing, but I still GM more than I play! I still maintain that it ain't rocket science. A subscription to Dungeon magazine and the worldbook of your choice is all you need to create a perfectly serviceable campaign without that much work.

-The Gneech

 

[WaterRabbit]

Most issues concerning gaming groups with difficult members focus on the players. How many of you have had to deal with difficult/bad DM's?

What constitutes bad DMing?

For me it's when I leave a game session and say to myself, "I'm not having fun".

Did you discuss the issues, or let it slide? What was the outcome if you did sit down and chat with your DM? Were you brutally honest or did you roll a 35 on your diplomacy check, and smooth talk your way through the issues?

I believe that it is important to talk with the GM. Take the GM out for a pint and give him/her constructive feedback. The GM may know that your are not having fun, but may not know why. If the GM is genuinely interested in everyone having a good time at the table, he will listen to your comments. He may not implement all of them, but it is likely the game will improve.

I once had a player in a game that clearly was not having fun. When I asked him for feedback, he told me it was just style differences. I dissolved the game and our group played other things. I am sure if he had been of the mind to give me more constructive feedback I would have run a better game and become a better GM.

On the other hand, I have run into GMs that know what their style is and don’t care about player opinions. Not being a masochist, I just moved on to a different game. If the GM isn’t open to constructive feedback, then giving is more trouble than it is worth. A few innocuous questions will generally determine if the GM is receptive to such feedback or not.

Being brutally honest is seldom constructive unless you never plan on playing with that GM again. I once played a game with the ultimate adversarial, railroading, sadistic GM. After the first session, my buddy and I never went back. The GM instead of getting the hint called me to find out what was up. I gave him both barrels of brutal honesty. I figured I would never see him again. Two years latter we both ended up as players in a game of VTES and then a Vampire LARP. It turned out we were both friends of the GM but ran in different circles. We were able to move beyond our past, but I wish I had been just a little more tactful. :\

 

[Anthraxus]

Just recently he tossed a full fledged Frost Giant, ECl=9/10 at us. It wouldn't've been too bad if we'd been a few levels higher... But for a party of avg level 3, this was a touch extraordinaire. Luckily, we only lost the first level ranger - the 5th level cleric had two hold persons ready and we survived - more on luck than anything. And this was a random encounter!

Well, hey, he let you off easy there. Hold person only affects humanoid creatures, not Giants. How nice of him to do that.

I have had an experience(a rare one, thankfully) in LG, where we had a really bad DM *all day* at a convention. No one wanted to complain or anything, but next time I think I would ask if we could switch DMs. :\

-A