How would a Troll, Ogre and Ghaele go epic?

[NPC]

I'm running a campaign with 1 troll, 1 ogre, 1 ghaele and a human rogue.

Anyway, how will the monster classes get to epic levels if they've used the monster level progressions listed in Savage Species?

Any ideas on how this would work? The ghaele has a 20 level progression. Can it take any Epic levels or is it stuck taking normal classes?

 

[Terwox]

I'm pretty sure that by the book they can only take normal levels, or epic prcs if they qualify, although they can take epic feats with their bonus feats. I think.

 

[Droid101]

I'm running a campaign with 1 troll, 1 ogre, 1 ghaele and a human rogue.

Anyway, how will the monster classes get to epic levels if they've used the monster level progressions listed in Savage Species?

Any ideas on how this would work? The ghaele has a 20 level progression. Can it take any Epic levels or is it stuck taking normal classes?

I was under the impression that you can only take epic levels or epic feats if it has 20 class levels. So something that was ECL 4 would have to be level 20 fighter (total ECL 24), and one the next level gained would start working on epic levels and could get epic feats.

That's how I'm running it (my characters are 21st level, one of them is 19th with an ECL of 21, but he doesn't get to take any epic feats yet, because he doesn't have 20 class levels yet).

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

I was under the impression that you can only take epic levels or epic feats if it has 20 class levels. So something that was ECL 4 would have to be level 20 fighter (total ECL 24), and one the next level gained would start working on epic levels and could get epic feats.

That's how I'm running it (my characters are 21st level, one of them is 19th with an ECL of 21, but he doesn't get to take any epic feats yet, because he doesn't have 20 class levels yet).

You're epic if your character level is over 20. Level adjustments are included in that. So, a tiefling with 20 levels of rogue is an epic character, and could take an epic feat if he had the opportunity to. So is a half-dragon half-celestial cleric-14, for that matter.

However, the epic adjustments for BAB and Saves (i.e. shift to poor BAB and Good Saves no matter what class you have) only kick in once you have 20 HD, racial or class-derived.

Brad

 

[hong]

I'm running a campaign with 1 troll, 1 ogre, 1 ghaele and a human rogue.

You realise that with a setup like that, you must at some stage have them walk into a bar.


Hong "so the bartender goes, what is this, a D&D campaign?" Ooi

 

[NPC]

Hong, as always, you crack me up.

I guess I just need to reread my EH and possibly start some house rules. Or just let the monsters know that they can take epic feats, skills, etc. but not epic classes until they get 20 class levels.

Thanks for your input!

 

[Angel Tarragon]

There is Character Level (CL) and Effective Character Level (ECL). ECL is a byproduct of MM2. I believe the definition of epic means a minimum of ECL 21. Meaning a Troll goes epic with its 9th class level.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

[hijack]

So what's your experience been of the ghaele in play? I've been toying with the idea of asking my DM for a ghaele cohort for a PC of mine, at an appropriate "level" via the Savage Species 20 level progression. But I don't want the cohort to completely overwhelm the campaign...

[/hijack]

 

[rrealm]

I was under the impression that you can only take epic levels or epic feats if it has 20 class levels. So something that was ECL 4 would have to be level 20 fighter (total ECL 24), and one the next level gained would start working on epic levels and could get epic feats.

I belive you are correct. I know I have read the answer to this question in one of the core books, I belive it was the epic handbook but now with a short epic segment in the 3.5 DMG, it might say there too.

 

[glass]

I thought it all worked off hit dice. When you get you 21st HD, you are epic and qualify to take epic feats, PrCs, etc. The trouble with ECL/LA is that it only applies to PCs. When do non PC monsters qualify for epic feats?

Not even the two original designers of the ELH seem to be able to agree on whether a epic character who happens to be a Ftr 2 can take epic feats from the expanded list in the ELH.


glass.