D&D 5E I just don't see why they even bothered with the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide.

[Shasarak]

Google is your friend. From this site: http://dlair.net/2015/03/22/lean-mean-rpging-machines/

In this case he was correct, TSR had far too large volume print runs of their books. They would have been better to run with smaller and more frequent print runs then they did and as WotC has shown by their many smaller print runs of their books that they have learned from this mistake.

 

[pukunui]

Definitely. Putting out one book per class and race was just too much.

I think it also didn't help that TSR was trying to support a whole bunch of campaign settings all at once. I can easily see WotC deciding to only support one setting at a time, like they did with 4e. So they're only going to provide content for the Realms right now, but once they've decided enough is enough, they'll move on to something else and just provide content for that setting until they're finished with that and then move on to the next one and so on. So all the settings may end up getting support, just not all at the same time. So you won't have multiple settings competing for people's attention (and dollars).

 

[delericho]

The transition to 2e, 4e and 5e, I believe, are the only editions that provide a story justification for mechanics and Class changes.

Um... so, out of four transitions (1st -> 2nd, 2nd -> 3e, 3e -> 4e, 4e -> 5e), only three of them provide story justifications?

 

[delericho]

Agreed, both of those are valid ways to approach a set of reviews. I personally tend toward the first, because I'm well aware of ways in which the 'wisdom of crowds' proves not to be all that wise (anything with Monte Cook's name on it, for instance, is going to be over-rated thanks to reviews that are basically, 'it's awesome because Monte!').

Yep. See also anything with Drizzt in it, where the reviews will be swamped by those who love Drizzt and those who hate him, and tend not to say much about the quality of this book.

Even so, I'm sometimes surprised that someone with whom I have general agreement with end up differing on some specific topic that makes my experience with a product very different from theirs, so even the system I use isn't foolproof.

Perhaps even more frustrating is that tastes change over time. For instance, back when 3e was first released it was damn-near perfect for me. And now, 5e much more closely matches what I want from the game... and that despite them being quite different from one another.

And since both my tastes and my favourite reviewer's tastes can and will change over time, and quite likely in different directions, there's a need to keep recalibrating.

Basically, I'm inclined to view reviews as a somewhat-useful but necessarily-imperfect guide.

 

[gyor]

In this case he was correct, TSR had far too large volume print runs of their books. They would have been better to run with smaller and more frequent print runs then they did and as WotC has shown by their many smaller print runs of their books that they have learned from this mistake.

I think the irony is is that TSR would have thrived in the current rpg enviroment, with stuff like kickstarter campaigns, pdfs, ect... they could have tailored there production far more to thier consumers, the current era of rpg allows for more flexiblity, makes it easier to dodge products that will be unpopular, ect...

If TSR had had these options like Print on Demand, PDFs, Kickstarters, Surveys, forums, virtual tables, ect... they would never have gone under, they would still have been able to produce most or all the content that they did.

Most of the problems could have been avoided, costs would have been cut ect...

I like Mike Mearls, but he's shouldn't be comparing how 5th edition is being handled to how TSR handled things, or how pre hasbro WotC handled things or hasbro has handled things in 4e.

If Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide had been a kickstarter (or another companies equivilant), it would have been a huge success, why?

Stretch goals, more player feedback, it would have been more about what fans wanted in it, then what WotC wanted to put in it.

So if player's wanted more gods make it a stretch goal, if wanted more details on regions make it a stretch goal, more player content make it a stretch goal, more locations like Kara Tur, Zakahara, Osse, Abier, ect... make them stretch goals.

You don't have to worry about having a product running at a loss.

 

[Herobizkit]

Anyone remember this?



This is what we got in Sword Coast Adventure's Guide minus the sexy Specialty Priests, and it's okay.

 

[delericho]

I think the irony is is that TSR would have thrived in the current rpg enviroment, with stuff like kickstarter campaigns, pdfs, ect... they could have tailored there production far more to thier consumers, the current era of rpg allows for more flexiblity, makes it easier to dodge products that will be unpopular, ect...

You assume TSR would have used any of those things. Based on what we know of the end days there, that's far from certain.

 

[JeffB]

Anyone remember this?

View attachment 71806

This is what we got in Sword Coast Adventure's Guide minus the sexy Specialty Priests, and it's okay.

It was a rules update for 2e and meant to be a supplement to the OGB and FR1 series. It was not an intro to the realms product geared towards players. Its a very different product than the SCAG.

 

[Parmandur]

I think the irony is is that TSR would have thrived in the current rpg enviroment, with stuff like kickstarter campaigns, pdfs, ect... they could have tailored there production far more to thier consumers, the current era of rpg allows for more flexiblity, makes it easier to dodge products that will be unpopular, ect...



If TSR had had these options like Print on Demand, PDFs, Kickstarters, Surveys, forums, virtual tables, ect... they would never have gone under, they would still have been able to produce most or all the content that they did.



Most of the problems could have been avoided, costs would have been cut ect...



I like Mike Mearls, but he's shouldn't be comparing how 5th edition is being handled to how TSR handled things, or how pre hasbro WotC handled things or hasbro has handled things in 4e.



If Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide had been a kickstarter (or another companies equivilant), it would have been a huge success, why?



Stretch goals, more player feedback, it would have been more about what fans wanted in it, then what WotC wanted to put in it.



So if player's wanted more gods make it a stretch goal, if wanted more details on regions make it a stretch goal, more player content make it a stretch goal, more locations like Kara Tur, Zakahara, Osse, Abier, ect... make them stretch goals.



You don't have to worry about having a product running at a loss.

One of the issues with the Kickstarter model is that it is, by nature, not retailer friendly. Retailers, who host Magic drafts and such, are WOTC lifeblood. 5E model, really, has been aimed very squarely at being small retailer friendly, promoting organized play that brings people closer to the place where they can buy Magic cards.

 

[Mercule]

BTW - for everyone else who is hoping for an Eberron book next... if you are expecting anything more substantial than what was given in the SCAG, you're going to be sorely disappointed. Because Eberron EVEN MORE than the Realms is going to have only the most basic fluff presented on the lands of Khorvaire. Simply because if the timeline isn't advanced... there will be NOTHING in a Khorvaire Adventurer's Guide that would be different than what you can right now get in both the 3E and 4E products in terms of continent fluff. They would literally just rewrite the same exact material they've already written twice now.

Sure... a Khorvaire Adventurer's Guide will be a godsend for the four races, Artificer, and dragonmark crunch... but EVERYHING else will be essentially unnecessary to any current Eberron player.

I would be overjoyed with this and consider it a huge win. Heck, it might go beyond "victory" and qualify as "coup", at this point.

I've got the original ECS and several other books. I want three things:

1) Well done, fully realized, 5E updates to the core crunch (races, Artificer, Dragonmarks, a few items). No need for 87 prestige classes and 43 feat trees, just the PHB level of coverage.

2) An in-print Eberron book that at least has an excuse to be on the store shelves and the visibility to the otherwise unaware (new players, etc.) that brings with it. Give my preferred setting a fighting chance.

3) A campaign book that is approachable enough that my casual players aren't intimidated by it, but also covers enough ground that I don't have to regularly explain things like the Day of Mourning.

So, again, it sounds like a KAG modeled after the SCAG would be a dream. Of course, the wrong author (or team) can screw up any formula, but the principle sounds good.