I just realized what bugs me about Warlords . . .

[Blothar]

I like Warlord well enough, and besides its been stated that D&D characters rarelly call themselves by their class "in-game" (ie. fighters think of themselves as sellswords, men at arms, warriors, swordsmen, pikemen, guards, toughs, officers, captains, enforcers etc.)

On another note I like centurion as an alternative to Warlord. The only drawback is that its a roman army denomination.

 

[rounser]

Thing is, though, Champion doesn't have any leadership connotations.

I disagree, I think they do to an extent; champions inspire others to fight for a cause, and push things forward.

The word suggests that they're actively pursuing something, which is what leaders are all about. e.g. In the corporate world, at least, you need someone to "champion" a project, or no-one takes ownership of it and cares about it's fate...so it's either doomed or forgotten.
I reckon that counts as leadership, just that it's leading by example and encouragement rather than bossiness or entitlement (as in the warlord connotation).

Inviting Bossy the Warlord into every party is asking for trouble, because some folks will look at that "warlord" title and see it as a license to be obnoxious, ordering other PCs around (maybe even violently - warlord, after all). Champ the Champion is probably more conducive to party harmony, and welcome for that matter.

 

[Thunderfoot]

There's plenty of 1st level warlords in real life. They're called 2nd lieutenants (or ensigns in the navy).

Funny, we just called them "most likely to be hit be friendly fire", when I was in.

BTW - what's the difference between a PFC and a 2 Lt? - the PFC has been promoted...twice!

 

[Imp]

I disagree, I think they do to an extent; champions inspire others to fight for a cause, and push things forward.

(snip)

Inviting Bossy the Warlord into every party is asking for trouble, because some folks will look at that "warlord" title and see it as a license to be obnoxious, ordering other PCs around (maybe even violently - warlord, after all). Champ the Champion is probably more conducive to party harmony, and welcome for that matter.

And champions can be pricks too: Achilles! It's flexible that way. But the thing about Captain and Commander and Centurion (otherwise a great name) is that those all imply rank – the Warlord problem writ small. I do agree that Champion isn't really perfectly aligned with the "leader of men" concept, but nothing really is without having specific connotations that mess things up. It does however have the virtue of implying that the class is charisma-powered.

 

[Jhulae]

I do agree that Champion isn't really perfectly aligned with the "leader of men" concept, but nothing really is without having specific connotations that mess things up. It does however have the virtue of implying that the class is charisma-powered.

And there was Boromir, the "Champion of Gondor". There's a fantasy connotation to Champion as well....

 

[The Merciful]

I like "champion" the best. It indicates a role and function, without implying rank or status.

 

[Scarbonac]

"Champion" is OK; what about "Valiant"? "Chevalier"? "Daredevil"? "Firebrand"? "Gallant"? "Lionheart"? "Stalwart"? "Bantam"? "Intrepid"? "Surehand"? "Dauntless"? "Steadfast"? "Bulwark"? "Fire-Eater"?

 

[RigaMortus2]

Perhaps I have AE on the brain, but Champion to me implies someone that 'fights for a cause'. Which is fine, if it fits with the class concept. We still don't know the mechanics or theme involved in the Warlord. Do they have class abilities where they bark out commands (like the Marshall from MiniHB)? Are they recognized leaders (the way Paladins are typically recognized as being honorable). IMXP, people (ie NPCs) often react differently when they see a Paladin walk down the street vs. a common Fighter walking down the street. Is the same going to hold true with a Warlord vs a Fighter?

 

[Lackhand]

IMXP, people (ie NPCs) often react differently when they see a Paladin walk down the street vs. a common Fighter walking down the street. Is the same going to hold true with a Warlord vs a Fighter?

Sure, and for the same reasons: Honking big charisma bonus!

 

[Nifft]

Sure, and for the same reasons: Honking big charisma bonus!

Could also be due to religious propaganda well publicized Code of Conduct.

Cheers, -- N