I know but please read it anyway and tell me what you think

[Nightstorm]

Yet another Ranger Variant
Alignment: Any
Hit Dice: d10

Class Skills:
Same as PHB

Skill Points at 1st level: (6+Int-modifier) x4.
Skill Points at Each Additional level 6+Int Modifier
Class Features:
1. Weapon and Armor Proficiency same as PHB
2. Track: A Ranger gains Track as a bonus feat.
3. Favored Enemy:
 At 1st level, a Ranger may select a Creature type as a favored enemy.
 If the Favored Enemy has a language, the Ranger gains proficiency in the language free at first level ( only if Ranger is taken at 1st level) .
 A Ranger can pick his race only if he’s evil or if the Ranger is non evil, a sub group that is evil (i.e. the humans from Bovd).
 If the Creature type is Humanoid or Outsider, the Ranger must pick a certain creature within the type (goblins, orcs, Aasimars, Devils etc)
 The Ranger gains a +1 Bonus at 1st, 5th, 10th, and 20th level to Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot and Wilderness Lore Checks when using these skills against his Favored Enemy.
 A Ranger also adds these bonuses to his Attack and Damage rolls against his Favored Enemy.
 This bonus applies to range weapons when the enemy is within 30feet.
 The damage bonus does not apply to creatures that are immune to critical hits until level 6.
4. Favored Enemy Critical Damage :
A Ranger now adds his Damage Bonus to his Favored Enemy attacks even if the creature is immune to critical attacks.
5. Favored Enemy Improved Critical:
This ability works as the feat “Improved Critical” except that
a. It works only against the Ranger’s Favored Enemy
b. It works with any weapon.
6. Ranger Bonus
At 12th and 18th level a Ranger may pick from the following Druid abilities: Nature Sense, Woodland Stride, Trackless Step .
Base Fort Ref Will
Level Attack Bonus Save Save Save Special
1 +0 +2 +0 +2 Track, Favored Enemy +1
2 +1 +3 +0 +3
3 +2 +3 +1 +3
4 +3 +4 +1 +4
5 +3 +4 +1 +4 Favored Enemy +2
6 +4 +5 +2 +5 Critical Damage
7 +5 +5 +2 +5
8 +6/+1 +6 +2 +6 FE Improved Critical
9 +6/+1 +6 +3 +6
10 +7/+2 +7 +3 +7 Favored Enemy +3
11 +8/+3 +7 +3 +7
12 +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 Ranger Bonus
13 +9/+4 +8 +4 +8
14 +10/+5 +9 +4 +9
15 +11/+6/+1 +9 +5 +9 Favored Enemy +4
16 +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10
17 +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10
18 +13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Ranger Bonus
19 +14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11
20 +15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Favored Enemy +5

 

[Nightstorm]

ok someone say something

 

[Spatzimaus]

It'd help if you just said "Here's how it differs from the PHB Ranger".

As far as I can see:
> More skill points (6 instead of 4)
> Will save becomes good
> Favored Enemy adds to both attack and damage (PHB is only damage)
> Favored Enemy also gives you a language (err, how exactly does that work for something like Magical Beast? Even assuming I count Blink Dogs, etc, there'd be a lot of languages)
> Favored Enemy damage works on things immune to crits once you hit level 6, then there's that free Improved Critical-like thing.
> You get some Druid abilities at 12 and 18

The downsides I can see:
> Lower BAB (3/4 instead of 1)
> No 2-weapon or Ambidexterity pseudofeats

Powerwise, I think you've added too much power to the class. The problems with the PHB Ranger have never been about power. It's got plenty of power as a class. Its failings were:
> Your key ability, FE, always depended more on the DM's campaign design than on your actions. If he gave you the enemies you wanted, you were really powerful, if he didn't it was a wasted ability.
> Too tied to the 2-weapon archetype, and if you didn't take that path you would get better mileage out of a Fighter/Cleric (nature/animal domains) multiclass.
> FE progresses in a bad way, forcing you to metagame; that is, pick Dragon at level 1 simply so that at high levels it's the +5 instead of Goblin.

The class design you have here is far more offensively dependent on Favored Enemy than the PHB version is (No 2-weapon, the lower BAB, extra FE-related Feats, and increased abilities of FE), but you haven't changed the accumulation of Favored Enemy in a way that'd solve the other problems I mentioned.

Suggestions:

> First, drop the HD to a d8 if you're going to give 6 skill points. The better Will save balances the lower BAB pretty well, so that doesn't need adjusting, although personally I'd prefer it the other way. Leaving it as d10 HD with mid BAB is very strange, since it turns what was an offensive class into a semi-defensive one.

> Change the FE-related abilities. For example, you could to a Monte Cook-style system where they get bonus Feats every 4 levels, taken from a short list that includes those Druid abilities, FE-related Feats, and maybe some archery stuff. The ability to do FE damage to things immune to criticals is a Feat from MotW, so it goes here too.

> Overhaul FE altogether. There have been some good suggestions on this board in the past. The one I like is give the Ranger a FE "point" at levels 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, and 11-20 inclusive, allowing them to put each new point into whatever category they want (with some limits), instead of this "increment each one you already had and start a new one at +1" system.

 

[jlhorner1974]

I agree with most of what Spatzimaus said, although I think the druidlike abilities aren't super important at high levels and shouldn't count much in terms of balance.

I always thought favored enemy was kind of stupid unless your DM does a fantastic job working this into the storyline without focusing on it too much, but frankly, I think most DMs aren't very good at this.

I also think the two weapon feats and favored enemy stuff should both go and rangers should get more useful benefits that are mostly nature-related.

I would prefer a customizable ranger with possible variants that are archer like or more shaman like (gaining abilities from totem animals: bears give Str bonuses or Scent, Aquatic creates gain swimming/water breathing, etc.).

As has been said elsewhere on the boards, the generalist classes in 3E all tend to be weaker than the specialists, with the possible exception of the druid.

Rangers just get totally shafted and even paladins aren't very balanced in the sense that they have almost nothing to look forward to at high levels (they have good low level abilities but almost nothign at high levels).

I'm hoping that rangers get some significant changes in the new revision of the core books due out in July.

 

[Nightstorm]

I think the real question is what is a ranger? When I think of a ranger, I think of characters from myth and lit such as Jack the Giant Killer, Robin Hood and Strider.So when we look at the Ranger we ask what makes a ranger and why does the ranger have what it has. So these were some of the things that I felt defines a Ranger.
1. A Ranger is a "fighter" type that either lives in the woods/wild and or spends most of his time there.
2. The Ranger, having spent so much time in the wild or for what ever other reason, has singled out a favored enemy.
3. A ranger lives by wit, knowledge of the wild, and blade.
4. Magic, though a Ranger MIGHT pick it up here or there(mulitclass) for the most part those in lit and myth do not.
5.So when looking at characters like Jack the Giant Killer one gets the idea that a ranger has such great knowledge of his enemy that when he hits true, he can do extra damage knowing the anatomy/weak points of his enemy.

Also , we need to ask what does not belong in the Ranger . The psudeo feats have no basis in this class.
Next we go to what is a focal of the favored enemy. Why does the ranger get more than one enemy? Is he full of hate? What's with that? In my version the Ranger stays with one enemy and progresses.
As for the language thing I thought it was clear. IF the enemy has a language, the ranger , who has studied his enemy would have picked up the language. Displacer Beasts?? I dont know. Do Displacer Beasts have a lang? if not, than the Ranger has nothing to learn there.
Over powered? How do you see that? here is what a high level Ranger [20th level]can do against his enemy:
1. He gets a +5 to hit and damage
2.This bonus works even against Undead
3. The crit range against his enemy ( and only his enemy)is improved with any weapon he uses against his enemy.