D&D 3E/3.5 I need some assistance in 3.5, class related

[Jackex]

I've not played much DnD in the past, but some friends want to get back into it, so we play some 4.0e. I quite enjoyed it but some other regular players of the game didn't like it as much as their old 3.5.

As far as I know the entire camp campaign is starting at level 1, no house rules are far as I know. They seem to be starting out pretty basic, Fighter, Cleric, Arcane, Bard, and I was asked to be a rogue style class. Now my total lack of 3.5e knowledge has left me wondering what to do. I was assuming just a human rogue, so I created a small story around that and was going to start building upon it to role playing standards. Problem is I don't want to be under powered with it, I hear rogue is a hard to build. Like they can't waste feats, I was planning to go a good bit into Charisma, Dex and Str. No idea what type of rogue, should i multi-class, but into what. Prestige classes are a bit far off.

Like I said i'm kinda lost here, starting is no problem, Weapon Finesse and Combat Expertise. I was also thinking of changing the story slightly into a two-weapon fighting ranger. Any help from someone who has played dnd 3.5 beyond level 5 would help a lot.

 

[Dandu]

I've not played much DnD in the past, but some friends want to get back into it, so we play some 4.0e. I quite enjoyed it but some other regular players of the game didn't like it as much as their old 3.5.

As you should.

As far as I know the entire camp campaign is starting at level 1, no house rules are far as I know.

What books?

Problem is I don't want to be under powered with it, I hear rogue is a hard to build.

Here's a core rogue build. If you go out of core, get Wand Chambers from Dungeonscape installed in your weapons and pick up wands of Gravestrike, Vinestrike, and Golemstrike. And the Craven feat, which lets you add your character level to sneak attack damage.

Like they can't waste feats, I was planning to go a good bit into Charisma, Dex and Str.

Focus on Cha, Dex, and Int. Avoid a Str or Wis penaltyi if possible, but those are really not critical stats.

No idea what type of rogue, should i multi-class, but into what. Prestige classes are a bit far off.

Assassin or Avenger are easy to get into for a Rogue. Chameleon is good as well. Thief Acrobat is ok.

Like I said i'm kinda lost here, starting is no problem, Weapon Finesse and Combat Expertise.

You can't take Weapon Finesse unless you have BAB +1, which you don't have at first level.

I was also thinking of changing the story slightly into a two-weapon fighting ranger. Any help from someone who has played dnd 3.5 beyond level 5 would help a lot.

Core Rogue/Ranger.

 

[billd91]

Before you decide that you're under-optimized, think of the rest of the players. If they're not big-time optimizers, it won't matter if you're not pushing the envelope. If they are, ask for their help. They'll probably already have some ideas that would fit in with the rest of the PCs.

Ultimately, without knowing more about the DM's and players' styles, we're kind of guessing at what would be a good fit for feats, skills, multiclassing, etc.

For most campaigns, I think multi-classing between ranger and rogue would work fairly well. Both classes have good skill points. The ranger's BAB gives a nice boost to the rogue. The sneak attacking from the rogue nicely boosts a two-weapon fighting ranger's damage when he's flanking. They're a pretty good fit.

 

[Starbuck_II]

If you have dungeonscape, take alternate class feature as soon as reach lv 2. There is one that lets you deal 1/2 sneak attk damage to undead, etc creatures normally immune to the damage.

You lose Trap sense (but that only gives minor +1 AC/saves vs traps).

 

[Jackex]

Before you decide that you're under-optimized, think of the rest of the players. If they're not big-time optimizers, it won't matter if you're not pushing the envelope. If they are, ask for their help. They'll probably already have some ideas that would fit in with the rest of the PCs.

I know one of the guys and one of the gals is a full on power gamer, the other two are more about their characters. As far as the DM goes, I have a feeling there will be more fighting then role playing in general.

I just need some direction, I heard someone to go like rogue/wizard another says that like 3 rogue/10 Chameleon/7 something else would be good. I'm just confused about which direction I should go if I focus on having lots of Cha, Dex and what ever int I can get. I know they expect me to do good damage, but if i go for like full on sneak attack, won't I be neglecting my other abilities as a rogue.

 

[Dandu]

No. Next question?

 

[Jhaelen]

I heard someone to go like rogue/wizard another says that like 3 rogue/10 Chameleon/7 something else would be good.

Didn't you say you were going to start at level1?

Then for heaven's sake, don't plan a level 20 char! There's nothing worse than planning twenty levels ahead to create a character that sucks for 19 levels until the 'build' is complete.

 

[Herzog]

There's nothing worse than planning twenty levels ahead to create a character that sucks for 19 levels until the 'build' is complete.

Yes there is: NOT planning ahead and creating a character that sucks for all 20 levels....

While Jackex is correct in that you should take into account that your character should be fun to play at every level, if you fail to plan ahead you will miss out on PrC entries. Check whether your DM is allowing the retraining rules in PH2: if so, you can postpone some choices until later, but if not, you have to make sure you have the right feats and skill ranks for when you want to take a certain PrC. Some of them have very high prereq's (like 13 ranks in three or more skills....) that you want to be prepared for.

Also, if you plan to mutliclass, check out the various dual class feats from Complete Adventurer and Complete Scoundrel (Scout/Ranger's should take Swift Hunter, I think there are several for Rogues as well although I can't remember their names)

 

[pawsplay]

For a rogue-type character, straight up Rogue or Scout are probably your best options. Like Dandu's core build, above, a mix of two-weapon fighting and ranged options is good. To avoid: spellthief, ninja, early entry into Thief-Acrobat, most medium BAB PrCs before 8th level. As for Chameleon in the like: if they were going to make you happy, you'd probably already know what they were good for. That is to say, exotic builds often hinge on a good understanding of what tactics you are trying to achieve in order to be truly effective.

I like the feat that grants sneak attack damage on crits, especially in conjunction with a rapier. If you go with scout, then I like it even more. It's a non-difficult, non-awkward way to potentially get skirmish damage more than once per round.

 

[Dandu]

For a rogue-type character, straight up Rogue or Scout are probably your best options. Like Dandu's core build, above, a mix of two-weapon fighting and ranged options is good.

Interesting note: The Ring of Blinking gives you the concealment necessary for sneak attacks. The 20% miss chance on your attacks incurred from shifting into the ethereal plane may not apply to ranged weapons because once an object leaves your possession (such as an arrow) it can't be affected by your Ring of Blinking and hits the target as normal.

Of course, the Blink spell says nothing about you retaining your equipment when you cast it on yourself, so... you might just drop all your equipment... including the Ring of Blinking...

Dammit, WotC...