TSR I think we’ve finally made it!

[toucanbuzz]

Underdark has been trademarked or copyrighted? Thought it was a generic term.

The term Underdark was created in the 1980s by TSR, so TSR owned that as copyright material until bought by Hasbro. They've specifically given notice that word is off-limits (for sake of the OGL folks to make their lives easier), so they haven't constructively abandoned it.

It wouldn't stop someone from publishing an adventure that mimics the Underdark. But they'd have to call it something different, like the Depths.

 

[Smackpixi]

“can be played in one or two sessions depending how the players drive the game.” So 15 bucks for a one shot?

 

[darjr]

Also, besides the logo, would the mimicking trade dress cause issues?

 

[Hussar]

“can be played in one or two sessions depending how the players drive the game.” So 15 bucks for a one shot?

Totally off topic but 15 bucks seems pretty reasonable for four to eight hours of entertainment for five people.

The undervaluing of rpg products is a long standing issue totally removed from this paricular dumpster fire.

 

[Yaarel]

Based on the recent history of the Nu TSR company, this product appears to be reallife hatespeech.

The "cult" appears to be demonizing innocent gays and transsexuals.

The hatespeech literally demonizes these innocents, while invoking the demonic concept of "Abaddon" from the Christian Bible.

Meanwhile, the product even repurposes hatespeech tropes that historically demonized innocent populations, such as "poisoning wells", in order to saturate their product with hate against reallife modern innocents.

If there is a reallife fringe religious cult that the NuTSR content creators belong to, that teaches them to hate innocents, then they need to pick a new religion. Religions can be tolerant and compassionate, and able to coexist alongside other humans.

 

[darjr]

Wait the author is Vincent who is The EvilDM who has since stepped away from NuTSR?!?

I didn’t know that.

 

[Deset Gled]

LaNasa and co. seem to suck plenty, but even Freud acknowledged that sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

Normally, I would tend to agree with you to not read too much into things. Abbadon and the Red Hand are common enough, and I generally give people the benefit of the doubt.

OTOH, I think it's unlikely that LaNasa would take swipe at ENWorld but not at anyone else. And NuTSR has a history of bigotry. If anyone ever needed a cultural editor so that they didn't accidently offend anyone, it's NuTSR. Unfortunately, it looks like they didn't budget much for any editor at all.

 

[Deset Gled]

Wait the author is Vincent who is The EvilDM who has since stepped away from NuTSR?!?

When did EvilDM step away from NuTSR?

 

[Maxperson]

Based on the recent history of the Nu TSR company, this product appears to be reallife hatespeech.

The "cult" appears to be demonizing innocent gays and transsexuals.

The hatespeech literally demonizes these innocents, while invoking the demonic concept of "Abaddon" from the Christian Bible.

Where are you getting that from? I don't see anything on the cover or in the release language that says or implies anything about gays and transsexuals.

 

[Yaarel]

Where are you getting that from? I don't see anything on the cover or in the release language that says or implies anything about gays and transsexuals.

Based on earlier NuTSR "public relations", it was pretty much the topic of transsexuals that caused the brains of its "spoke persons" to fall out.

Ernest Gygax is guilty here too.

Yes, there is sharp edition warring, against non-1e D&D gaming styles.

But it is the topic of gender identity that correlates their descent into full-on (maybe even legally actionable) hatespeech.

 

[bennet]

Based on earlier NuTSR "public relations", it was pretty much the topic of transsexuals that caused the brains of its "spoke persons" to fall out.

Ernest Gygax is guilty here too.

Yes, there is sharp edition warring, against non-1e D&D gaming styles.

But it is the topic of gender identity that correlates their descent into full-on (maybe even legally actionable) hatespeech.

Did you also make up the stories about Dave Chappelle being anti-trans despite have a very close trans friend who opened his shows, who then killed herself after people like you attacked her for sticking up for Dave. Just curious. Ernie Gygax and company may be idiots but I wouldn't automatically make up stuff in attempts to stick it on them.

 

[Maxperson]

Based on earlier NuTSR "public relations", it was pretty much the topic of transsexuals that caused the brains of its "spoke persons" to fall out.

Ernest Gygax is guilty here too.

Yes, there is sharp edition warring, against non-1e D&D gaming styles.

But it is the topic of gender identity that correlates their descent into full-on (maybe even legally actionable) hatespeech.

The earlier stuff was waaaaaay out of line, but you can't just arbitrarily apply it to this module and then label the module hate speech. It doesn't work that way. You need to have something in the module itself that you can point to if you want to make that sort of accusation.

 

[darjr]

When did EvilDM step away from NuTSR?

I think it's mostly conjecture from Tenkar based on Vinces behavior of late.

Based on the below start time where he doesn't seem to know Michaels title or didn't know he was leaving.


There is more about Michael and TSR but I couldn't make the clip longer.

Here is where he says he's just reporting on their stuff. No mention of working with them on content? Or other projects.


And it's only been 2 days since his last video but nothing about his adventure nor anything on his twitter nor in the discord.

But I have to agree that's it a guess.

Also LeNasa is spamming the indogogo on his own discord.

 

[darjr]

Did you also make up the stories about Dave Chappelle being anti-trans despite have a very close trans friend who opened his shows, who then killed herself after people like you attacked her for sticking up for Dave. Just curious. Ernie Gygax and company may be idiots but I wouldn't automatically make up stuff in attempts to stick it on them.

Oh no. No you do NOT! NuTSR absolutely went down that road. And NuTSR, blaming Dinehart, did as well on Twitter.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

We could do an in depth analysis thread like that one we did for Oracle of the Forest.

We’d need it to be widely readable over the Internet, and that probably wouldn’t be a good thing. I mean…

what if it’s something like the Lament Configuration or The Ring (as in, the cursed videotape), but in RPG adventure form?

 

[Yaarel]

The earlier stuff was waaaaaay out of line, but you can't just arbitrarily apply it to this module and then label the module hate speech. It doesn't work that way. You need to have something in the module itself that you can point to if you want to make that sort of accusation.

Like I said. Recent history.

Meanwhile the response by NuTSR remained unrepentant to public criticism (even criticism from other members of the Gygax family).

 

[Deset Gled]

Where are you getting that from? I don't see anything on the cover or in the release language that says or implies anything about gays and transsexuals.

I can't speak for anyone else, but Kim Wincen called some things out as being antisemitic, not anti-LGBTQ. I was under the impression he was implying the cult referenced this, but I'm not always up to date on antisemitism:

Red string (Kabbalah) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[jdrakeh]

Did you also make up the stories about Dave Chappelle being anti-trans despite have a very close trans friend who opened his shows, who then killed herself after people like you attacked her for sticking up for Dave. Just curious. Ernie Gygax and company may be idiots but I wouldn't automatically make up stuff in attempts to stick it on them.

Ernie and other NuT$R employees absolutely came out against transgender folks. Granted, there's no way of knowing if that carries over to this module. BUT there's absolutely a public record of Ernie and Dinehart (prior to his departure) coming out against trans folk at the very least.

 

[Maxperson]

Like I said. Recent history.

Recent history doesn't mean that the module is what you say it is. You NEED to show something in the module itself.

Meanwhile the response by NuTSR remained unrepentant to public criticism (even to criticism coming from other members of the Gygax family).

This is true. They're called NuTSR for a good reason. That reason doesn't mean that this module is attacking gays and transsexuals, though. You can't just arbitrarily apply history, even recent history to this module.

 

[Yaarel]

Recent history doesn't mean that the module is what you say it is. You NEED to show something in the module itself.

This is true. They're called NuTSR for a good reason. That reason doesn't mean that this module is attacking gays and transsexuals, though. You can't just arbitrarily apply history, even recent history to this module.

The hateful references against "Morris" largely relates to the ENWorld community defending these innocents from the NuTSR corporation.