Ice Age Item Creation

[fusangite]

I'm currently running an ice age campaign in which two characters, a Shaman (as per the Green Ronin handbook) and a Wizard have just reached the point where they are considering taking item creation feats. A couple of problems present themselves:
1. Item creation involves expenditure of GP. There is no cash economy in my world. The characters periodically find stores of coins but leave them behind because they are of no utility. If you were to run item creation in a world with no cash economy, what would you substitute for the GP requirement in item creation?
2. The quality of items and loss of knowledge is such that no character has the capacity to produce a masterwork item; how can I get around this problem for characters who wish to fashion magic weapons?

All opinions and supplemental questions greatly appreciated.

 

[Alchemist]

My quick and dirty answers would be:

1. Item creation involves expenditure of GP. There is no cash economy in my world. The characters periodically find stores of coins but leave them behind because they are of no utility. If you were to run item creation in a world with no cash economy, what would you substitute for the GP requirement in item creation?

What is used as wealth in your game? Deplete that instead. Alternatly one could make the item creating characters use special materials in place of wealth, much like using special materials in place of xp works.

2. The quality of items and loss of knowledge is such that no character has the capacity to produce a masterwork item; how can I get around this problem for characters who wish to fashion magic weapons?

All opinions and supplemental questions greatly appreciated.

Rule 0. Waive such restrictions and allow them to enhance whatever they can lay their hands on. I suppose you could make them expend other personal resources (xp, wealth, whatever) to compensate if you feel there's going to be a balance problem.

 

[Nifft]

The items to be enchanted must be blessed by a spirit (for the Shaman) or contain parts of specific magical beasts (for the Wizard).

Spirit blessings cost XP (1 xp = 10 gp), but are fairly easy to get. Spirits may assign quests in place of XP, or whatever Spirits in your world like to make mortals do.

Magical beasts are as tough as you make them. Perhaps the item in question requires not just any Roc feather, but the down of a great Roc (33+ HD, Colossal size). These encounters should result in XP for the character, but no other treasure. Also, the Wizard must pay double the XP cost, which is still less than the Shaman pays.

-- N

 

[Spatzimaus]

1. Item creation involves expenditure of GP. There is no cash economy in my world. The characters periodically find stores of coins but leave them behind because they are of no utility. If you were to run item creation in a world with no cash economy, what would you substitute for the GP requirement in item creation?

Item creation involves the expenditure of GP only because it requires the expenditure of resources. The gold isn't magically vanishing from your pockets; it's that you're using up expensive materials (eye of newt, skin of toad, wings of buffalo) in the process of enchanting the item. Even if you have no cash-based economy in your world, these items should still exist, and have value based on their usefulness. Unless you're in a low-magic world, of course.
If you use some other form of currency, just use whatever the exchange rate is. If you rely on barter, things get a bit more complex, since the guy you're trying to trade with might not understand WHY you want him to harvest unicorn spleens and aboleth testicles, so the price might not be what you'd expect. Barter systems tend to have less price feedback.

If you don't want to mess with an economy at all, just double the XP cost and remove the GP cost altogether.

 

[Tewligan]

(Repeated from the D&D Rules thread)
Require specific materials for the items. I've always assumed that the GP cost of making magic items reflects the rare components you have to gather. Since they can't just buy what they need, they'll have to actually go out and risk life and limb to get those things that "modern" D&D mages just plunk down the gold to get. Maybe a wand needs to be carved from the tusk of the oldest mammoth of a certain herd, who can only be killed in a certain way in order for the tusk to be enchantment-worthy. A ring needs to be carved from ice taken from a distant legendary valley. Also, if you're requiring the item to be made from special materials like these, I'd say just ignore the masterwork requirement.

 

[Tonguez]

(Repeated from the D&D Rules thread)
Require specific materials for the items. I've always assumed that the GP cost of making magic items reflects the rare components you have to gather. Since they can't just buy what they need, they'll have to actually go out and risk life and limb to get those things that "modern" D&D mages just plunk down the gold to get. Maybe a wand needs to be carved from the tusk of the oldest mammoth of a certain herd, who can only be killed in a certain way in order for the tusk to be enchantment-worthy. A ring needs to be carved from ice taken from a distant legendary valley. Also, if you're requiring the item to be made from special materials like these, I'd say just ignore the masterwork requirement.

Like most others here I require PCs to gather the resources they require to make objects of power. I also use a lot of 'gifts' - eg a Feather Token might be a gift given by the 'Eagle Spirit' to the PCs becuase they helped him in a fight against the Spirit Naga. In another instance the PCs assisted a women who had been kidnapped by a Ogre MAge to return to her mother. Her mother was the Ocean Mother and rewarded them with the 'Calabash of Winds'

 

[Rackhir]

2. The quality of items and loss of knowledge is such that no character has the capacity to produce a masterwork item; how can I get around this problem for characters who wish to fashion magic weapons?

All opinions and supplemental questions greatly appreciated.

What kind of materials are weapons made from in your campaign. If we are talking bone, wood, flint etc... then something as simple as an iron or steel sword IS effectively a magic item relative to primative weapons.

Also a world that primative sounds like it should definitely be low magic. If so it's certainly not unreasonable to strictly limit the feasability of creating magic items. Though you might want to permit a wider range of items to be created from one feat as compensation.

One last thought, it might be better to permit the creation of one signature item per character that they can then improve through XP, exotic components, completing great quests etc... Resources are typically painfully limited in primitive settings, so it would be much more in the feel of a campaign to avoid the "Oh, not ANOTHER +1 longsword".

 

[Tzudralkor]

how does being a wizard work in an ice age campaign? i would think that there would not be any writing, let alone books for spells to be written in

 

[fusangite]

Thanks so much everyone for your responses so far. Many of your suggestions are going to be incorporated.

how does being a wizard work in an ice age campaign? i would think that there would not be any writing, let alone books for spells to be written in

This wizard did not start as a wizard. Part of the campaign is people discovering the remnants of the vanished civilization from which they were descended. The wizard is a guy who started as a ranger and gradually accumulated enough magical writings from the ancient society to figure out how to cast arcane spells.

A lot of the game is people trying to piece together their history and discover what caused the ice age.

 

[fusangite]

What kind of materials are weapons made from in your campaign. If we are talking bone, wood, flint etc... then something as simple as an iron or steel sword IS effectively a magic item relative to primative weapons.

Dead on. That's how ordinary metal items have been functioning up until now but it's also true that there exist special/enchanted natural bone, skin and flint weapons within the culture. I don't want magic in the world to just be about recovery of the past but for the ice age magic system to be dynamic and, in some ways, competitive with recovered technologies.

Also a world that primative sounds like it should definitely be low magic.

But culturally, a world like that is traditionally alive with spirits, curses, etc. I want to capture that feel too. In D&D, all too often, there is a technology-magic equivalency which isn't always helpful.