If I critical hit on a natural 18 but need a 19 to hit do I still hit?

[robberbaron]

Understood, but when did not being RAW stop houserules?

I believe that if you only hit your foe because 'you always hit on a 20' you shouldn't expect to be able to critical. There's Luck and there's LUCK. Maybe I'm influenced by AD&D when, if your THAC was higher than you could roll, you couldn't hit. The number of times I had a host of gribblies completely unable to touch the PCs are innumerable.

It hasn't actually come up in (3.5) game yet, though I have mentioned it in the past and, either no-one was listening at the time (not difficult to imagine given the noise the players make) or no-one present was of a mind to disagree. Anyway, it's not like I wouldn't rule the same for NPCs.

 

[Angerland]

houserules aside. that would crush someone as a player, especially a non warrior type.

The rogue (or monk or whatever), finally gets a 20 on some big baddie that has been cleaning the parties clock for sevral rounds. Everyone waits holding their breath while the rogue rolls to confirm and, against the odds, rolls a second 20 only to have the DM say.."hmmmm.. sorry nope, no one is THAT lucky"


do what you do, I guess, it's your game after all.

 

[irdeggman]

houserules aside. that would crush someone as a player, especially a non warrior type.

Or someone with a weapon with a special property that depends on a confirmed critical hit:

Examples:

Any of the Bursts (flaming, icy, shocking)
Thundering
Vorpal

 

[robberbaron]

If you critical a non-criticalable (I think I may have invented a word) creature a weapon's special property still fires so I would accept it happening on a double 'need 20' hit.

I can appreciate the possible demoralising effect of not being able to critical a super-hard foe but there is also the effect on a super-twinked out until he is nigh on invulnerable fighter who gets a double 'needs 20' hit from his opponent.

Makes Bless Weapon and True Strike a bit more valuable. Not much, I agree, but who takes True Strike now? Also, makes getting bonuses/giving penalties more important - using tactics for flanks, grappling, tripping, touch attacks in general, aid another, etc.

There are plenty of, to me, strange houserules out there. I don't think mine is especially odd.

 

[Nail]

.. who takes True Strike now?

Power attacking Warrior/Mages. With Wraithstrike, if allowed.


(IMC: No wraithstrike, FWIW.)

 

[Nail]

Understood, but when did not being RAW stop houserules?

At no time does RAW prevent Houserules.

I wasn't sure you knew the RAW in this case. A presumption on my part..

 

[robberbaron]

No worries, Nail. I don't always remember the rules correctly, though certainly more often than some of my players.

I don't expect everyone to like my ideas. Heck, my players don't always like them but they play by them, which is good enough for me. (Hmm, there isn't a 'smug' smiley)

 

[Nail]

No worries, Nail. I don't always remember the rules correctly, though certainly more often than some of my players.

Me too.

'course, I come here to keep my rules-fu strong. Getting schooled once in a while is good for me.

 

[lottrbacchus]

luck and LUCK

i'd let the character roll to confirm the critical. luck= making that 1 in 20 roll. LUCK = rolling two 20s in a row at the right moment (1/400 chance!)

 

[Thanee]

So with a Rapier, I roll a natural 20 then a 18 to confirm on a 21 AC = hit but no Critical?

I think you are saying against an AC of 21 the only way to hit is to first roll a 20 and to then critical roll another 20? Even if the weapons critical range is 18-20?

Let's say you have a total attack bonus of +2 (1st-level Rogue with Dex 14 and Weapon Finesse, using a Rapier).

You need to hit AC 21.

You roll a natural 17, which results in a 19. It's neither a hit (< 21) nor a threat (only natural 18-20 is, if you also hit).

You roll a natural 18, which results in a 20. It's not a hit (< 21) and thus no threat either, though it would have been a threat (18-20), if it had hit.

You roll a natural 19, which results in a 21. It's a hit and a threat.
Now you need to confirm, and for that you need to hit AC 21 again, which means a roll of natural 19 or 20 to hit AC 21 with the +2 bonus.

You roll a natural 20, which is an automatic hit and threat.
Now you need to confirm, and for that you need to hit AC 21 again, which means a roll of natural 19 or 20 to hit AC 21 with the +2 bonus.

Bye
Thanee