If I critical hit on a natural 18 but need a 19 to hit do I still hit?

[RedFox]

Wasn't this a... why yes, it's a proud nail!

Securing Critical Hits

I like the rules for critical hits: You need to roll within the threat range, and then roll a successful confirmation hit. In general, this is equivalent to needing to roll a successful hit, and then rolling a second die within the range. So battle axes score criticals on 1 out of every 20 hits, while longswords score them on 1 out of every 10.

The problem arises in the corner case where your threat range includes numbers that wouldn't be good enough to hit your target. Then the above no longer holds true. For example, if I'm using a longsword against a creature that I can only hit on a natural 20, then I'll only score a critical on 1 out of every 20 hits.

Whack!: There's an easy fix to this, though. Make the confirmation roll need to be either enough to score a successful hit or land within the weapon's threat range. Now the nail's in all the way.
-- Dan

 

[Corbert]

Wow. That's too bad.

That's also not RAW.

• Rolling a natural 20 on an attack roll is an automatic hit,
• confirming a threat is another attack roll, and
• rolling a natural 20 on an attack roll (while confirming a threat) is an automatic critical hit.

I Completely agree. In my campaign, if 2 natural 20's in a row are rolled, not only is the critical confirmed, it is considered automatically maximum damage, and the player gets to roll again. On a third confirmed hit the player gets to add normal damage to the maximum crit already out there. If the 3rd roll is another 20 (incredibly rare, but I've seen it happen with my own 2 eyes) the PC got in a vastly lucky shot, like maybe a stab through the eye straight into the brain, killing the enemy instantly.

 

[Vrecknidj]

Perhaps a feat (one that wouldn't be terribly popular, I wouldn't think) could "fix" this.

Threatening Wielder (okay, a better name is necessary)
Prerequisite: Weapon Focus in a weapon with a threat range greater than 20.
Benefit: If an attack roll or a critical confirmation roll is within the threat range, then it is a successful hit or confirmation.
Normal: If an attack roll is anything other than a natural 20, then it may miss or not confirm a critical hit if the result isn't sufficient to overcome the opponent's armor class.

Then again, who wastes a feat on this?

Dave

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Threatening Wielder (okay, a better name is necessary)
Prerequisite: Weapon Focus in a weapon with a threat range greater than 20.
Benefit: If an attack roll or a critical confirmation roll is within the threat range, then it is a successful hit or confirmation.
Normal: If an attack roll is anything other than a natural 20, then it may miss or not confirm a critical hit if the result isn't sufficient to overcome the opponent's armor class.

Then again, who wastes a feat on this?

Everyone with a 18-20 weapon with keen or the improved crit feat? Hitting with 15+ guaranteed, even with the lowest attacks? Power Attack away!

 

[Rystil Arden]

Perhaps a feat (one that wouldn't be terribly popular, I wouldn't think) could "fix" this.

Threatening Wielder (okay, a better name is necessary)
Prerequisite: Weapon Focus in a weapon with a threat range greater than 20.
Benefit: If an attack roll or a critical confirmation roll is within the threat range, then it is a successful hit or confirmation.
Normal: If an attack roll is anything other than a natural 20, then it may miss or not confirm a critical hit if the result isn't sufficient to overcome the opponent's armor class.

Then again, who wastes a feat on this?

Dave

If that feat existed, it would be the most overpowered feat in the game for a Fighter sort (Divine Metamagic being possibly more overpowered for others). Automatic hit on a 15? Huh?

 

[Jhulae]

houserules aside. that would crush someone as a player, especially a non warrior type.

The rogue (or monk or whatever), finally gets a 20 on some big baddie that has been cleaning the parties clock for sevral rounds. Everyone waits holding their breath while the rogue rolls to confirm and, against the odds, rolls a second 20 only to have the DM say.."hmmmm.. sorry nope, no one is THAT lucky"


do what you do, I guess, it's your game after all.

Um, if the only way the enemy could be hit was with a Natural 20 and that houserule was in effect (and I've played under that specific houserule with no qualms), why's the DM even letting the player roll again? And why would the rogue's *player* even be rolling again with all the other players holding their breath? They'd all be aware of the houserule too..

 

[Stalker0]

If that feat existed, it would be the most overpowered feat in the game for a Fighter sort (Divine Metamagic being possibly more overpowered for others). Automatic hit on a 15? Huh?

Agreed....the fact that my crappy 3rd attack always had a 25% hit chance would be amazing.

 

[Stalker0]

Further, the fact that this scenario exists actually helps to balance critical ranges.

If you look at 19-20/x2 and 20/x3, stastically they provide the same average damage...except that in reality they don't.

Let's say I have a monster with 90 hp left. I crit with my x2 and do 100 damage, bam killed the guy. I now crit with my x3 and do 150 damage, bam killed the guy. But all of that extra crit damage was wasted because the guy was already dead, my x3 did nothing to help me. And this happens decently often I would say.

But on the flip side, the extended critical range of the 19-20 doesn't always come into play. My 19 crit threat is wasted when I can only hit on a 20. So in the cosmological balance its a good thing