D&D 5E If you use thunderstep but teleport less than 10 feet do you take damage?

[Maxperson]

It might add a small bit of challenge for the players when the spell is used by the PCs, but it will also reduce challenge for the players when used against the PCs by an NPC.

Maybe it's the migraine I have right now, but that doesn't compute for me. How does an enemy using it reduce the challenge for the players? It could increase the challenge a bit for me, but that doesn't necessarily translate to less challenge for the players.

 

[Irlo]

Maybe it's the migraine I have right now, but that doesn't compute for me. How does an enemy using it reduce the challenge for the players? It could increase the challenge a bit for me, but that doesn't necessarily translate to less challenge for the players.

Because the enemies won't have the flexibility to thunderstep less than 10' away without taking damage. In the same way the players are limited, the NPCs are limited. If the NPCs are limited, they present less of a challenge to players.

 

[Maxperson]

Because the enemies won't have the flexibility to thunderstep less than 10' away without taking damage. In the same way the players are limited, the NPCs are limited. If the NPCs are limited, they present less of a challenge to players.

That's not necessarily true. It might be advantageous for me in other ways to do a short teleport like that and take the damage and deal damage to PCs in the process. Or I might not need to teleport a short distance in order to be challenging to the players. It the challenge to ME, but that's not the same as less challenge to the players.

 

[Irlo]

You cannot interrupt a singular effect like teleportation. For the trigger to finish, the teleport must finish. I mean, you're arguing that someone can ready an action to run behind a wall if a fireball blooms to the size of 5 feet. Then he gets to freeze the fireball in mid explosion and move, then fireball gets to continue exploding. It doesn't work like that. You can't split an effect.

As I see it, readied actions are just a way to determine order of resolution of actions. Like the initiative order in general, it isn't meant to imply a stop-and-go sequence in which everyone takes a turn then freezes and waits for their next opportunity to act. The system breaks down sometimes (sometimes = almost all the time), but the rules seem clear enough to me on this point that one could move behind that wall.

 

[Lyxen]

That makes no sense. There's no requirement for you to pick the path in order to cross space. I don't pick the path of the airplanes I board, but I still cross space to the place I am landing.

You do not, but the pilots certainly do. They depose a flight plan in advance, their progress is checked against that flight plan, and everyone coordinates when there is a change.

Teleport also crosses space even though the caster doesn't pick the path. It just does so instantly and bypasses physical obstructions. In other words, it goes through another dimension to get you there.

Prove it. Where does it say that ? Which dimension ? What happens when the other dimension is not available ? This interpretation opens a much larger can of worms.

Moreover, if you go to another dimension, you are certainly not "crossing space" anyway.

And...............................I've said the same thing in like every post man. You cannot appear in the sphere, yes. What the sphere does not do per RAW is stop the teleport from beginning outside the sphere.

It does. It specifically says that the sphere cannot be used as a destination. Doing this causes the teleportation to fail. Plain english words.

This is not written anywhere, but would be a ruling the DM could make.

It is written: the teleportation fails. It is further supported by Xanathar and the rule on invalid targets. So I have actually two rules supporting my claim, and you have none. Please stop inventing things like "crossing space", "other dimensions", and "within the sphere". It's not what is written.

The rules for the anti-magic sphere do not say teleportation fails. It says, teleportation fails WITHIN THE SPHERE. Only half of it fails, not all of it.

No, it does not say that. Once more, you are not using the words of the rules, but ones that you make up.

"This spell instantly transports you and up to eight willing creatures of your choice that you can see within range, or a single object that you can see within range, to a destination you select."

There. It transports you to a destination. There is no mention of not crossing intervening space and without such wording, it works like any other transportation other than you arrive instantly. YOU have to prove your claim of no intervening space, which isn't said anywhere.

No, YOU have to prove your claim, in THIS POST, that " Teleport just transports you, which means you do cross the intervening space". Your incorrect claim (that you went back to), not mine.

What's more, Dimension Door is a teleport spell.

Yes, so ?

Clearly from the name, teleportation goes through another dimension(plane). And, the Hallow spell says this.

Huh, no. Where does it say that it goes through another dimension or plane ? It's just a door in your 3 dimensions that takes you from one place in these 3 dimensions to another place in these 3 dimensions. Where does is say that there is another dimension involved ? Which one ? How is it named ?

"Extradimensional Interference. Affected creatures can't move or travel using teleportation or by extradimensional or interplanar means."

Clearly teleportation is travel through another dimension, or it wouldn't be placed in the Extradimensional Interference category. If travel happened with no intervening space, no other dimensions would be accessed and Hallow would not affect it.

It's just a category name, and you should notice that, in the desctiption it clearly says : "Affected creatures can't move or travel using teleportation or by extradimensional or interplanar means."

This clearly shows that there is teleportation, and there is extradimensional/interplanar and that they are NOT the same thing.

And more. The School of Conjuration in the Wizard Class says this.
"As your mastery grows, you learn spells of transportation and can teleport yourself across vast distances, even to other planes of existence, in an instant."

Not travel instantly without crossing intervening space, but rather it explicitly says you teleport across the vast distances.

Hu, yes, so what ? Does it say that there is a path ? Does it say that you go to another dimension ? Nothing of the kind. It just says that you teleport across vast distances.

So again, you need to prove that all of what RAW says or implies is wrong and that your claim of no intervening space being crossed when you teleport is correct.

Proven many time over. It's actually funny, because you are the one who first claimed that intervening space was crossed, now that it is in another dimension (so actually it's not crossed), which one is it?

My point is only that the rules are not as specific as you think. You can decide things in your campaigns, but the rules support a large variety of other interpretations, which are just as interesting. Don't box yourself in because of habit, in particular of previous editions, they are not necessarily applicable in 5e, which is way more open.

 

[Lyxen]

You cannot interrupt a singular effect like teleportation.

Prove it. Where does it say so in the rules ? I'm waiting for an exact quote, mind you, as I have PROVEN to you through rules that reactions (in particular of readied action) interrupt someone's turn, irrespective of what they are doing.

As a very simple example, an opportunity attack with sentinel interrupt's one singular action of moving. The action does NOT complete. Prove to me that teleportation cannot be interrupted.

For the trigger to finish, the teleport must finish. I mean, you're arguing that someone can ready an action to run behind a wall if a fireball blooms to the size of 5 feet. Then he gets to freeze the fireball in mid explosion and move, then fireball gets to continue exploding. It doesn't work like that. You can't split an effect.

Again, show to me the EXACT rule that says this. There is none.

Edit: moreover, you are wrong about what a spell does. There is only ONE spell effect (although it can be complex), the PH tells it to you clearly: "Each spell description in Chapter 11 begins with a block of information, including the spell’s name, level, school of magic, casting time, range, components, and duration. The rest of a spell entry describes the spell’s effect."

And nothing says, ever, nowhere, that it cannot be interrupted. Play it whatever way you like in your campaign, the rules just don't say what you think they say.

 

[Lyxen]

As I see it, readied actions are just a way to determine order of resolution of actions. Like the initiative order in general, it isn't meant to imply a stop-and-go sequence in which everyone takes a turn then freezes and waits for their next opportunity to act.

Of course, it does not work that way with freeze and go, all the actions are done more more or less simultaneously. However the RESOLUTION of them is done purely sequentially and arbitrarily. For the readied action in the middle of Thunder Step, it's just that the guy was watching the caster, and as soon as he begins to fade, he is actually already moving, nothing more. There are many good ways to describe the way the actions meld together into something that looks like a movie, but the RESOLUTION is clearly sequenced the way I present it, because it makes sense, is way more heroic in a sense (because it encourages the players to project themselves in the game world and anticipate what the other party is going to do), and it provides (at least to us) a system which is way less constrained by game constructs.

 

[Irlo]

Of course, it does not work that way with freeze and go, all the actions are done more more or less simultaneously. However the RESOLUTION of them is done purely sequentially and arbitrarily. For the readied action in the middle of Thunder Step, it's just that the guy was watching the caster, and as soon as he begins to fade, he is actually already moving, nothing more. There are many good ways to describe the way the actions meld together into something that looks like a movie, but the RESOLUTION is clearly sequenced the way I present it, because it makes sense, is way more heroic in a sense (because it encourages the players to project themselves in the game world and anticipate what the other party is going to do), and it provides (at least to us) a system which is way less constrained by game constructs.

Yes, I am agreeing with you.

 

[Maxperson]

Prove it. Where does it say that ? Which dimension ? What happens when the other dimension is not available ? This interpretation opens a much larger can of worms.

I have proven it. Spells affecting interdimensional spells affect teleport. Why is that?

Moreover, if you go to another dimension, you are certainly not "crossing space" anyway.

You are, you're just crossing it in that dimension.

It does. It specifically says that the sphere cannot be used as a destination. Doing this causes the teleportation to fail. Plain english words.

Quote me where it says "It causes teleportation to fail." My book says, "Teleportation and planar travel fail to work in the sphere..." Which is different. It has no effect on the departure point outside of the sphere.

No, it does not say that. Once more, you are not using the words of the rules, but ones that you make up.

I just quoted it dude. It explicitly says "within the sphere." You're inventing some sort of failure to teleportation outside the sphere.

Huh, no. Where does it say that it goes through another dimension or plane ? It's just a door in your 3 dimensions that takes you from one place in these 3 dimensions to another place in these 3 dimensions. Where does is say that there is another dimension involved ? Which one ? How is it named ?

It says they cross the distance. It's on you to prove that they don't.

This clearly shows that there is teleportation, and there is extradimensional/interplanar and that they are NOT the same thing.

It's separating teleport, which uses extradimensional space to teleport, and Rope Trick which creates extradimensional spaces. The category stops ONLY extradimensional effects, be they planar, teleportation or extradimensional spells like Rope Trick.

 

[Maxperson]

Of course, it does not work that way with freeze and go, all the actions are done more more or less simultaneously. However the RESOLUTION of them is done purely sequentially and arbitrarily. For the readied action in the middle of Thunder Step, it's just that the guy was watching the caster, and as soon as he begins to fade, he is actually already moving, nothing more. There are many good ways to describe the way the actions meld together into something that looks like a movie, but the RESOLUTION is clearly sequenced the way I present it, because it makes sense, is way more heroic in a sense (because it encourages the players to project themselves in the game world and anticipate what the other party is going to do), and it provides (at least to us) a system which is way less constrained by game constructs.

So just to clarify your position. According to you I can ready an action to move 20 feet if a thunderous boom begins to happen, but before it reaches me. Then if the caster uses Thunder Step I can interrupt because the trigger happened and blithely move out of the way, taking no damage?