Illithid vs DR

[SableWyvern]

It's true that DR doesn't help against a grapple check. However, note in the description of the mind flayer's abilities in the MM:

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, the mind flayer must hit a Small to Large creature with its tentacle attack. ... If it gets a hold, it attaches the tentacle to the opponent's head.

After a successful grab, the mind flayer can try to attach its remaining tentacles with a single grapple check.

To me, that suggests that the mind flayer's Improved Grab would not work on a creature with DR, since the ability requires that the mind flayer hit with its normal attack first. Thus, the Extract ability wouldn't come into play either, since _that_ requires all tentacles to be attached. If it was already grappling, however (ie it managed to make a grapple check normally) then it could make grapple checks as normal to attach all its tentacles.

But a hit is a hit, regardless whether or not DR reduces the effective damage to zero. The ilithid only needs to hit with its tentacle - there is no minimum damage requirement.

While I could understand a ruling that DR can prevent a brain-suck, I don't think this would be a rules-as-written interpretation.

 

[hong]

But a hit is a hit, regardless whether or not DR reduces the effective damage to zero. The ilithid only needs to hit with its tentacle - there is no minimum damage requirement.

While I could understand a ruling that DR can prevent a brain-suck, I don't think this would be a rules-as-written interpretation.

The general rule is that if a hit fails to overcome DR, any special effects that depend on that hit don't work (except energy effects and some others). You could interpret it either way for an Improved Grab attempt, I guess.

 

[kreynolds]

Grapples do NOT rely on damage to function. You just need to hit the AC of your target. Dealing damage in a grapple is completely optional. Read grappling in the PHB. DR does nothing against grapple. Trust me. There is no possible way to take this discussion as far as Mind Blank. There is no hidden conspiracy with this rule.

 

[Kazoo]

Grapples do NOT rely on damage to function. You just need to hit the AC of your target.

So if this is correct then couldn't an Illithid make a touch attack on someone, without doing any damage, but could then attach it's tentacles using the improved grab function.

In the improved grap description it says the the tentacle only has to hit. It doesn't say it has to cause damage. Having it make a touch attack means it would be able to bypass Natural Armor and regular Armor, and it still satisfies the improved grab function. It wouldn't get the 1d4 damage, but so what, it would still be able to attempt to grapple and hold, and then on the next round extract. So would this work?

 

[kreynolds]

Absolutely, Kazoo.

 

[Dwarmaj]

It still feels wrong to me...

If the Mind Flayer was using a Supernatural or some other magical ability to remove a brain, then I could see them getting around DR.

However, the Mind Flayer is physically incappable of getting past 10/+1 DR, how can it use it's tentacles to rip open an opponants skull?

What happens if the target is wearing a full helm, does the Mind Flayer rip right through steel?

Dwarmaj

 

[kreynolds]

ARRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!............I give up.