Implementation of divine powers

[Fifth Element]

I agree entirely. Based on the limited preview, this is one of the biggest things that bother about 4th Ed.

It's pretty much the only thing that really bothers me so far about 4E. I really like the arcane and martial classes as presented. I just hope it's an artifact of the limited preview rather than something permeating divine classes at all levels.

 

[Fifth Element]

I think the idea is that "Channel Divinity" is a single per encounter ability that has multiple ways in which it can be used. Its entered in twice on the character sheet, but you could just as easily write it like this:

Channel Divinity (per encounter)
Divine Mettle, OR,
Divine Strength.

And presumably feats like the cleric's Amaunator feat can add other options to your Channel Divinity power.

Yes, it is effectively a single encounter power that has 3 possible effects. They could have presented it that way but probably figured this way was cleaner. I guess the question is why do only the divine classes have this? Or is it just an artifact of the limited preview?

 

[Gloombunny]

It might have been something they came up with specifically to deal with Turn Undead. Having an encounter power that only works on undead would suck when you're not fighting undead and have this useless ability taking up space in your powers list, so they give you the option of spending that usage on a different ability. Then I guess they got carried away and added a bunch more divine-channel powers to take advantage of that mechanic.

The hand-laying limit smells like something that was added after playtesting when an initial version limited only by the paladin's surges was too good somehow.

 

[eleran]

I like Priest's Shield as well. That works thematically for me since the cleric is right there with the ally in battle, so the ally can benefit from his divine afterglow, so to speak.

My problem was with the paladin power, which gives an AC bonus to an ally up to 25 feet away. Harder for me to conceptualize.

I wonder if the thinking was that during most combat encounters when the Paladin will be in there mixing it up with the bad guys, some member of his party that is not as heavily ACed as he is is going to need a little AC pick me up. With the Paladin being a Defender, he cant be everywhere on the battlefield at once so he asks his god for a little favor for his poor mage buddy who has been waylaid by a kobold or two?

"Hey Bahamut. I am doing my best down here, but Lumpkin the wizard over there could use a little bit of your coolness to help him out til I can get over there and do it myself. I am only 1 guy after all. amen"

 

[Storminator]

Just a minor quibble - it's probably a pet peeve but I'm interested in seeing if other people have noticed it.

Why does it seem as though Divine Power characters don't exactly follow the "At Will, Per Encounter, Per Day" model used by all the other classes?

There just seem to be an awful lot of exceptions in the case of Divine classes. You can use Lay on Hands at Will, but it's actually 3/Day. You can use a certain Per Encounter ability, but if you do you can't use another one (not really different from the Sorcerer spellcasting style).

I just find it a little strange given how neatly they've made it for all the other classes.

I would have called Divine Channeling Per Encounter abilities with three of different effects then said you have that power twice. For Lay on Hands, I would have called it a Daily Power, then said you have it 3 times.

PS

 

[Fifth Element]

It might have been something they came up with specifically to deal with Turn Undead. Having an encounter power that only works on undead would suck when you're not fighting undead and have this useless ability taking up space in your powers list, so they give you the option of spending that usage on a different ability.

That's a good point. But it doesn't explain the equivalent for the paladin (Channel Divinity), or why the cleric has two possible effects in additional to Turn Undead.

 

[Cadfan]

I would have called Divine Channeling Per Encounter abilities with three of different effects then said you have that power twice. For Lay on Hands, I would have called it a Daily Power, then said you have it 3 times.

PS

Agreed. When I create game aids for newer players, I will give any paladins three "lay on hands" note cards, and one "divine channeling" note card.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

The "piggy"-backing effect doesn't sound like the most elegant solution yet. Maybe we need to see more of them. Maybe it will always feel "awkward"... :/

But the different ways the abilities work and diverge from the at will/per encounter/per day scheme should be seen as something that enforces the idea that the character classes play differently, despite all using the same basic concept for ideas.

 

[Carnivorous_Bean]

Although I really like a lot of what I've seen of 4th edition, I agree that these two disconnected effects of one ability are something that I rather dislike.

However, I also see why they made them. There used to be dozens, scores, perhaps hundreds of discussions over on the Wizards boards about how people hated playing clerics, and to a lesser extent paladins, because they buffed and healed INSTEAD of whacking things.

Now they're giving the people exactly what they were asking for -- a way to participate in combat every round and still give some advantage to another member of the party.

I can understand why they did it, and it's certainly not something that's going to change my mind about my preorder. I just wish that there was some way to achieve a balance between having the paladins and clerics fight and still be useful to their comrades, and the mental 'disconnect' of the abilities.

Still, it should be possible to fluff it as the "Pelor, protect my comrade while I cannot, because I am smiting thy foes" syndrom.

 

[The Shadow]

I'm not sure why it's even necessary to limit Lay On Hands to 3 times per day. I mean, it uses up one of the paladin's Healing Surges, so it's inherently limited already?

Is the daily limitation simply to avoid a potential "15 minute day" again?