Information on Druids

[Ydars]

What other people have said on this thread is accurate; who the Druids were and what they believed is lost to us. The Romans destroyed them and we only have Roman accounts of them left.

All the "pagan" stuff out there was made up, like things like ley-lines, by groups of slightly strange Victorians in the Neo-Classical revival when they started to revere "the noble savage" in the late 1800s. This is where all those present day "druid ceremonies" at Stone-Henge come from.

So make your own stuff up!

 

[Cam Banks]

It's not strictly true that the knowledge and practice of druidry was wiped out by the Romans. Their successors, the Brehons, were arbitrators and officials within Irish society and Brehon Law is the foundation of much of historical Irish common law. In addition, Celtic Christianity differed markedly from that of Rome inasmuch as it had absorbed many of the practices and observances of the Irish.

So, while it's very true that modern neo-paganism is not a direct descendent of any pre-Christian faith, those pre-Christian faiths have informed, influenced, and in some cases been absorbed into Christian practice. This was an extremely common occurance all across Europe, in fact, and there is ample evidence that Christian saints were originally pre-Christian god/goddess figures, religious leaders, pre-Christian heroes, or amalgams of such instituted as a means of easing the transition toward a Christian society.

I would make a Google search for Brehon law; the Order of Bards, Ovates, and Druids (the secular one); Celtic Christianity; Saint Patrick's translations of pre-Christian documents (although you need to be careful with that based on the conflict between certain Irish abbeys on who holds claim to the "true" Patrick) and Skara Brae (which, while not exactly ideal, could inform you of the social aspects that druidry may have influenced.)

Cheers,
Cam

 

[Ydars]

Cam; I have read alot of Peter Berrisford Ellis' books on the Brehon and have never come across any reference to them having a Druidic connection. Where did you hear this as I would be interested in exploring such a link?

 

[Cam Banks]

Cam; I have read alot of Peter Berrisford Ellis' books on the Brehon and have never come across any reference to them having a Druidic connection. Where did you hear this as I would be interested in exploring such a link?

I'd love to give you a reference! Unfortunately, my wife's the Irish medieval historian, and it was her advisor who had all of the notes.

Cheers,
Cam

 

[Treebore]

Both Cambell and Frazer have received a lot of criticism though. They might provide some good information but I'd take their interpretations of the meanings of things with a grain of salt.

But I agree, unfortunatly we can't ask the druids So just make it up!
As far as I know there really isn't any solid information on them. The little info we have is from Christian missionaries, I think. Which is of course biased...

Name me anyone who can say anything about Druids and not get argued with about it. Like a previous poster pointed out, there simply is not any definitive historical sources which can make anyone an authority.

Personally I let the Slaine Graphic Novels be my guide. With some stuff stolen from the book, "Druids".

 

[ferratus]

Joseph Campbell is largely discredited in the academic community, as have the Durkheim, Jung, Freud, Marx and all the other fellows who followed in the footsteps of G.W.F. Hegel. For Joseph Campbell in particular the criticism is quite blunt. In order to find common elements, he takes certain themes and symbols and divorces them from their original meaning, then comes up with an explanation of why they are the same underlying story. This is because unlike those savages and bumpkins he is a learned "social scientist" versed in Jungian psychology. He knows better than others about what goes on in our "collective unconscious". Peh. It is both bad research and bad pseudoscience.

 

[Stormborn]

Having just recently done a bit of research in this are for a project of my own let me add my voice to those who are telling you that in spite of some glimmerings we can get from various sources already mentioned we have no real understanding of what druids were, what they believed, or what they did. All we can talk about is what their detractors, immitators, and would-be spiritual decendants would tell us. There is no source of information for their religion that is going to give you what you are looking for that can be easilly accessed. Even most academic sources are not going to give you much more than speculation and debate.

Therefore you are either going to have to make it up or take what the social scientists and neo-pagans tell you.

 

[Fifth Element]

Well I don't think explaining further is a topic allowed on this forum, so you just have to do without an explanation.

Hmm? My point was that the term "pagan" is so broad as to be useless here.

 

[apoptosis]

Joseph Campbell is largely discredited in the academic community, as have the Durkheim, Jung, Freud, Marx and all the other fellows who followed in the footsteps of G.W.F. Hegel. For Joseph Campbell in particular the criticism is quite blunt. In order to find common elements, he takes certain themes and symbols and divorces them from their original meaning, then comes up with an explanation of why they are the same underlying story. This is because unlike those savages and bumpkins he is a learned "social scientist" versed in Jungian psychology. He knows better than others about what goes on in our "collective unconscious". Peh. It is both bad research and bad pseudoscience.

Freud is certainly NOT discredited. I am a neurochemist and do research in psychopharmacology so have a bit of expertise in this subject. While he was by no means accurate, his work was the basic foundation for psychotherapy which is still widely practiced (and according to clinical studies shows robust efficacy in treating many psychiatric diseases).

I will get off the soapbox before I fall. Not really even a huge fan of Freud but think he gets a bit of a bad rap.

He definitely has his critics and many of his theories are fundamentally incorrect (accoring to our current knowledge base) he did have a lot of nice insights particularly in the area of childhood development and its imprinting on the adult psyche. He had MANY ideas and theories some good, some pretty bad.

 

[justanobody]

Hmm? My point was that the term "pagan" is so broad as to be useless here.

I was meaning how some of the holidays translate over from druidic/pagan origins to current religions is what I couldn't go into.

Some strong theories still support druids building Stonehenge, so the times of their existence coincide with being able to lend those certain holidays to the existing ones....if you subscribe to either of those ideas.