keterys
First Post
If the changes were made, these two are both equal or better, not worse. It actually pretty much solves all druid and ranger AC problems.
You could have just put "Warlocks", since it would affect all of them.
Last edited:
Intelligent reflexes?
- Thread starter Oldtimer
- Start date
Well...
These are all Wis-primary, so they are in the clear.
They are Wis-secondary, not Int-secondary.
Yes, warlocks could need heavy armour
And Non-Dex-secondary. So, of the PHB1 builds, only the staff wizard is getting the shaft (pun most definitely intended).
Bards already have access to heavy armour.
Yes, something needs to be done for them.
I don't use them, so I can ignore them for the moment.
So, I would need to look at warlocks, swordmages, and staff wizards.
Which you wouldn't even have to do at all, if at character creation time, no players select those three classes. So it could very well end up being a non-issue for you by making the switch to Dex/Wis, Int/Cha.
So you might be fine at this point without ever needing to directly address the issue yet.
You're talking about the ones that get nerfed but what about the whole bunch of wisdom-primary classes that you are giving a significant boost to - if you do this they no longer have to worry about spending on a secondary stat or feats to boost themselves.
Personally, I think making this sort of change is pointless, but go ahead if you feel you must...
Personally, I think making this sort of change is pointless, but go ahead if you feel you must...
Can you be more specific? Which Wis-primary class would this give a significant boost to?
Well, off the top of my head, Avenger, Druid and Shaman would all receive a significant boost from WIS and INT being swapped over.
I know druids and shamen often look at chain armour proficiency, but with WIS boosting AC they wouldn't need to anymore. Avengers often take a high DEX to boost their AC, but with WIS adding to AC they wouldn't need to push this so much. The effect would be to release more attribute points/feats for advancing the PC.
I think that in swapping over INT and WIS, he would just be 'creating a rod for his own back'. But as I said previously, it is his game, go ahead if you want to.
Dr_Ruminahui
First Post
I think Avengers would be the biggest problem (kind of the reflection of the swordmage problem) - the have a built in mechanic to give them near defender AC in cloth armour, and if you let them use their prime stat for AC they'll likely have better AC than most defenders - which may be a bit unballancing for a striker.
That's a bit surprising considering that Avengers are Int- or Dex-secondary. But I've never seen an Avenger in real play, so I'm a bit unfamiliar with how they work at the table. Still, that could just be as simple as reducíng the bonus from Armor of Faith.
DracoSuave
First Post
They're a melee striker that depends entirely in engaging foes in one-on-one combat, so AC is actually required for them to do their job right. They're purposefully isolating an enemy, so they're going to have to take hits from that enemy. Contrast that with a rogue who isn't isolating any foe, and can stick around the defender who probably is taking multiple foes.
'Multiple foes' sounds like a place Avengers can't hang out.
At any rate.... isn't this variant rules country? Should probably ask to get this moved to the right forum.
Not as big as you think tho.
Last edited:
When I've seen avengers in-play, they tend to make WIS & DEX about the same start value, relying on the two attack dice to make up for lower primary WIS, and using the higher DEX to get themselves a good AC.
Please note they usually try to take the PHB3 feat Unarmoured Agility, which adds another 2AC for cloth wearers.
With WIS & INT swapped, no class adjustment, and Unarmoured Agility taken, this would allow a level 1 avenger(WIS 20) to match AC with a level 1 paladin wearing plate + heavy shield. (AC 20) This would also allow them to focus on their primary stat more and therefore increase hit chance and damage output.
Please note they usually try to take the PHB3 feat Unarmoured Agility, which adds another 2AC for cloth wearers.
With WIS & INT swapped, no class adjustment, and Unarmoured Agility taken, this would allow a level 1 avenger(WIS 20) to match AC with a level 1 paladin wearing plate + heavy shield. (AC 20) This would also allow them to focus on their primary stat more and therefore increase hit chance and damage output.
Similar Threads
