(IR) 2nd ooc-thread of the 5th IR (open)

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We have a new player. Album Cover X.
So, I will be adding him to the roster ASAP.
Album, I will be putting Suhfang in your claims.

Cheers. Another good player, for our IR. :)

Edena_of_Neith
 

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SE, ask and you shall recieve

Ethergaunt

Travelers to the Ethereal Plane report vast fields of nothingness, roiling fog cloaking a barren landscape. Sometimes, however, they come upon fantastic stone pyramids or cyclopean menhirs topped with flashing magical flames, relics of an ancient race. Knowledgeable scholars refer to the fearsome creators of these structures as ethergaunts, after their emaciated, delicate frames. An advanced culture that abandoned the Material Plane more then 10,000 years ago, the ethergaunts are finally comming back, with a vengeance.

Adult ethergaunts stand 8 feet tall and resemble extraordinarily thin humanoids. An ethergaunt’s long, thin arms reach to mid-calf; each hand has three agile fingers and a thumb. An inhuman face caps a short neck that protrudes from the center of the creature’s chest, giving the thergaunt a somewhat stooped appearance. Because few creatures gaze upon an ethergaunt’s face without taking severe damage to their psyches, the creatures have develloped bisected masks and exosceletons that serve to give them a somewhat humanlike appearance. Dozens of colorful, prehensile tendrils emerge from behind the mask like a mane of thick, fleshy hair. The faceplate resembles a featureless porcelain visage, and the mask’s color reveals the ethergaunt’s role in the creatures’ pragmatic society. Red ethergaunts serve the race as scientists and explorers. White ethergaunts manage the reds’ affairs and form the primairy government of the race. The dreaded black ethergaunts control the entire society of ethergaunts; fewer then one hundred blacks are thought to exists. Other colors and roles may exist.

Ethergaunts have a great disdain for the creatures that have inhabited “their world” since their ancient departure. They have progressed technologically and philisophically to a point where they consider most inhabitants of the Material Plane no more relevant then insects. While they see themselves as beyond good and evil in the classic sense, they are not pleased at the current infestation of their old home, and have set upon the most devastating extermination in history.

Ethergaunts communicate with each other by wriggling their head tendrils, which transmits a psychic “soundprint” identifiable as language to other ethergaunts within normal hearing range. They occasionally communicate with members of Material Plane races by revealing their true faces to one of the creature’s cohorts and using that dominated ally as a psychic puppet-envoy. In such communications, the ethergaunts refer to themselves as the Khen-zai. Ethergaunts communicate with each other using their own language, Khen-zai, which cannot be learned by those who lack their unique anatomy. Most know a smattering of other languages---usually tongues plucked from the minds of enslaved envoys. Comman additional languages include Common, Draconic, Dwarven, and Elven.

Combat

Though members of each ethergaunt caste have unique individual spells and abilities, the race as a while shares a number of characteristics.
Enslave (Su): Three times per day, an ethergaunt can attempt to enslave any one living creature within 30 feet. This ability functions similarly to a dominate monster spell (caster level 16th; Will save DC 13 for red, DC 16 for white and DC 20 for Black Ethergaunts). An enslaved creature obeys the ethergaunt’s telepathic commands to the letter. The subject can attempt a new Will save every day to break free. Otherwise, the ethergaunt’s control is broken only by the death of either the ethergaunt or the enslaved creature, or by a remove curse or dispel magic effect, or if the ethergaunt travels more then 1 mile from the enslaved creature or travels to a different plane from the one its thrall is on.

At any given time, an ethergaunt may have one slave per point of Charisma bonus (normally one slave for a red or white ethergaunt or two for a black, although exceptional individuals may be able to command more slaves).

Stupefying Gaze (Su): An ethergaunt can open and close its vertically bisected mask as a free action, revealing a horrifically alien morass of facial organs and orifices. On its turn, the creature decides if it wants its mask open or closed. Anyone within 30 feet of an ethergaunt with an open mask who meets the creatures gaze must succeed on a Will saving throw (DC 13 for red, DC 16 for white, and DC 20 for black ethergaunts) or immediately take 1d4 points of Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma damage. A creature that successfully saves against this effect cannot be affected by the same ethergaunt’s stupefying gaze for one day.

Ethergaunts are immune to their own gaze attacks and to those of others of their kind.

Immunity to Spells (Su): Ethergaunts may choose to ignore the effects of arcane spells, just as if the spellcaster had failed to overcome spell resistance. They have no power over divine spells, having long ago rationalized divinity out of their racial philosophy. Though powerfull, this ability is somewhat limited. It applies only to arcane spells of 2nd level or lower for red ethergaunts, 4th level or lower for white ethergaunts, and 6th level or lower for black ethergaunts.

Material Jaunt (Su): Ethergaunts dwell on the Ethereal Plane. While in their natural state of etherealness, they can percieve but not affect creatures and objects on the Material Plane. However, an ethergaunt can transport itself from the Ethereal Plane to the Material Plane as a standard action. It can remain on the Material Plane for up to 1 round per Hit Die it possesses. At the end of this time, or when the ethergaunt chooses, it becomes ethereal again. An ethergaunt must remain on the Ethereal plane for at least an hour after a material jaunt before it can use this ability again.

Ethergaunts who wish to remain on the Material Plane for a longer time must use plane shift or similar magic. Most white and black ethergaunts know the plane shift spell and use it for this purpose.

Total Vision (Ex): An ethergaunt’s superdeveloped brain and countless facial sensory organs allow it to discern all objects within 40 feet, even through the mask that hides its face. An ethergaunt usually does not need to make spot or listen checks to notice creatures within range of its total vision. A silence spell has no bearing upon an ethergaunt’s total vision.

Ethergaunt society

Ethergaunt society serves the dual goals of philisophical progress and self-preservation. The Khen-zai define progress as the culling of emotion in order to approach perfect rationality. They define self-reservation as the removal of any threat to their carefully developed objective philosophy. The inhabitants of the Material Plane threaten both philosophy and preservation, and hence must be destroyed.

Rigidly stratified through an immutable caste system, an ethergaunt’s role in society is largely defined by the actions (or lack thereof) of its predecessors. The Khen-zai long ago eliminated irrational ambition by ensuring that no ethergaunt can ever achieve a greater status. Once during its lifetime, however, an ethergaunt can produce a young Khen-zai through asexual reproduction. The child’s caste, hence the color it will bear upon its faceplate for its entire life, is decided before it is born by a cadre of black ethergaunts who weigh the achievements of the child’s ancestors before assigning the child’s caste.

Ethergaunts gather in small communities known as enclaves, usually situated around a large central pyramid that serves as a center of learning for the entire comminity. The largest such settlements boast as many as ten black ethergaunts, fifty white ethergaunts and as many as five hundred reds.

Ethergaunt items

Ethergaunts have developed a number of technological marvels. Because the race shuns art or pleasure, most such devices facilitate one of two activities: genocide or the eradication of religious devotion. Though the features of these objects resemble those of magic items, the objects are in fact technological and are not affected by spells such as antimagic field. Only ethergaunts have the knowledge and skill to build or maintain these devices.

Example weapons:
Etherblade: Resembling a short glaive topped with a hollow barrel, this favored weapon of the ethergaunts can fire a ray of force as a ranged touch attack for 1d6 points of damage. The etherblade ray has an increment of 40 feet. The weapon can fire 50 times before it is exhausted. It cannot be recharged.

An etherblade can be used as a two-handed weapon in melee combat to deal 1d10 points of slashing damage. A fully charges etherblade has a marker price of 800 gp.

Doubt Bomb: This ceramic sphere contains a chemical mixture intented to overstimulate the “doubt centers” in the brain. The bomb can be thrown as a grenadelike weapon. A thrown bomb shatters on impact, creating a cloud of poisonous gas in a 10-foot spread (initial and secondairy damage 1d6 Wisdom, Fort DC 15 negates). Ethergaunts are immune to the effects of doubt bombs.

A doubt bomb has a market price of 500 gp.

BLACK ETHERGAUNT
Medium-Size Aberration (Extraplanar)
Hit Dice: 16d8+32(104hp)
Initiative: +8
Speed: 30 ft.
AC: 29 (+4 Dex, +15 natural), touch 14, flat-footed 25
Base Attack/Grapple: +12/+13
Attack: Etherblade +13 melee, or etherblade +16 ranged touch
Damage: Etherblade 1d10+1, or etherblade 1d6
Face/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Enslave, spells, stupefying gaze
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., material jaunt, immunity to spells, total vision
Saves: Fort +7, Ref +9, Will +12
Abilities: Str 12, Dex 18, Con 14, Int 31, Wis 15, Cha 15
Skills: Concentration +21, Diplomacy +23, Heal +21, Knowledge (arcana) +29, Knowledge (any three) +29, Listen +21, Move Silently +23, Sense Motive +21, Spellcraft +31, Spot +21
Feats: Combat Casting (B), Empower Spell, Exotic Weapon Profeciency (etherblade) (B), Extend Spell, Heighten Spell, Quicken Spell, Spell Penetration, Transdimensional Spell
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground (Ethereal Plane)
Organisation: Solitary or council (1black, 5 whites, and 12 reds)
Challenge Rating: 17
Treasure: Double standard
Alignment: Usually neutral evil
Advancement: By character class

Black ethergaunts stand at the pinnacle of khen-zai society. Honored as near-divine philosopher-scientists, the black caste is credited with advancing ethergaunt society to its present state of perfection. No lesser khen-zai question the will of a black ethergaunt, for to do so is to question the progress of the entire race.

By far the thinnest and most emaciated of the ethergaunts, blacks lack the physical power of their underlings---a deficiency balanced by a brain that allows them to outthink even the most intelligent opponent. Their black faceplates represent a complete void of emotion---the khen-zai believe that the blacks have rid themselves of all emotion, thus allowing them to command the race without being clouded by weaknesses such as regret, compassion, and mercy. Despite pretensions to the contrary, however, most black ethergaunts possess an abundance of selfish emotions such as greed, ambition, and hubriss.

Combat
Black ethergaunts are rarely found without a handful of powerful slaves that serve as bodybuards. If necessary, they sacrifise their thralls to protect themselves. Though they are able to use etherblades, black ethergaunts consider engaging in physical combat to be a sign of failure, preferring to rely on spells or technological items such as doubt bombs. They particularly hate clerics, viewing divine spellcasters as a threat to the khen-zai’s atheist philosophy. Rather than change that philosophy, the black ethergaunts have decided to simply eliminate the divine spellcasters.

Spells: A black ethergaunt can cast arcane spells as a 17th-level wizard (4/7/7/6/6/6/6/3/3/2; save DC 20 + spell level).

RED ETHERGAUNT
Medium-Size Aberration (Extraplanar)
Hit Dice: 5d8+5(27hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 30 ft.
AC: 16 (+2 Dex, +4 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 14
Base Attack/Grapple: +3/+5
Attack: Etherblade +6 melee, or etherblade +6 ranged touch
Damage: Etherblade 1d10+3, or etherblade 1d6
Face/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Enslave, spells, stupefying gaze
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., material jaunt, immunity to spells, total vision
Saves: Fort +2, Ref +3, Will +6
Abilities: Str 14, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 23, Wis 15, Cha 13
Skills: Concentration +9, Heal +10, Knowledge (arcana) +14, Listen +10, Move Silently +10, Spellcraft +16, Spot +10, Survival +10
Feats: Combat Casting (B), Exotic Weapon Profeciency (etherblade) (B), Track, Weapon Focus (etherblade)
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground (Ethereal Plane)
Organisation: Solitary or team (1--6)
Challenge Rating: 9
Treasure: Standard
Alignment: Usually neutral evil
Advancement: By character class

By far the most frequently encountered caste of ethergaunts, reds serve the race as scouts, trackers, and low level diplomats (particularly when diplomacy in fact means exterminating natives to send a political message). Though they hold an arrogant opinion of their own importance in relation to the current residents of the Material Plane, reds fully understand their role as the rank-and-file of the ether legions. The fact that ethergaunt grunts are generally more brilliant than the brightest human mages reveals much regarding khen-zai perspective.

Slightly shorter and bulkier than their superiors, red ethergaunts sport a crimson faceplate that marks them as creatures who have yet to purge the fires of passion from their rational minds. Accordingly, many of the more powerful reds view the struggle against the Material Plane races as a battle of the cultured against ravenous barbarians.

Combat
Red ethergaunts are adept at the use of the etherblade, a scientific weapon invented by the khen-zai during their sojourn to far planes. Most ethergaunts prefer to take potshots with the weapon from a distance instead of engaging in melee.

Spells: A red ethergaunt can cast arcane spells as a 9th-level wizard (4/6/6/4/3/2; save DC 16 + spell level).

WHITE ETHERGAUNT
Medium-Size Aberration (Extraplanar)
Hit Dice: 11d8+22(71hp)
Initiative: +3
Speed: 30 ft.
AC: 23 (+3 Dex, +10 natural), touch 13, flat-footed 20
Base Attack/Grapple: +8/+9
Attack: Etherblade +9 melee, or etherblade +11 ranged touch
Damage: Etherblade 1d10+1, or etherblade 1d6
Face/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Enslave, spells, stupefying gaze
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., material jaunt, immunity to spells, total vision
Saves: Fort +5, Ref +6, Will +9
Abilities: Str 12, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 27, Wis 15, Cha 13
Skills: Concentration +16, Diplomacy +17, Heal +16, Knowledge (arcana) +22, Knowledge (the planes) +22, Listen +16, Move Silently +17, Sense Motive +16, Spellcraft +24, Spot +16, Survival +2 (+4 on other planes)
Feats: Combat Casting (B), Empower Spell, Exotic Weapon Profeciency (etherblade) (B), Extend Spell, Spell Penetration, Transdimensional Spell
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground (Ethereal Plane)
Organisation: Solitary, pair, or cadre (3--8)
Challenge Rating: 13
Treasure: Double standard
Alignment: Usually neutral evil
Advancement: By character class

White ethergaunts, who serve the rae as scholars, philosophers, diplomats, and bureacrats, occasionally parley with the Material Plane races in order to serve the greater goal of planar domination. Cunning schemers, whites attempt to purge all emotion from their dealing, instead dedicating themselves to an objective (in their view) pragmatism. Whites seldom give an inch, and their “negotiations” generally boil down to suggestions that fighting off inevitable genocide will only result in unnecessary struggle and needless destruction of material resources.

White ethergaunts are the tallest of their race. They often clothe themselves in robes and skirts of an organic material resembling rubber. They care nothing for red ethergaunts, viewing them as worthless pawns (but still a thousand times more valuable than a hundred Material Plane creatures’ lives). Most white ethergaunts respect their black overlords, but a few of the most ambitious secretly plan to usurp their autority and take over ethergaunt society. Such irrationality, when discovered by the highest cast, is eradicated immediately.

Combat
Though skilled at the use of the etherblade, most white ethergaunts avoid melee, preferring to rely upon spells or the fantastic technological weapons develloped by the black ethergaunt cast.

Spells: A white ethergaunt can cast arcane spells as a 13th-level wizard (4/6/6/6/6/4/3/2; save DC 18 + spell level).

Ethergaunt Characters
Ethergaunts sometimes become rogues or fighters, but their favored class is wizard. Ethergaunts who add levels of wizard add their natural spellcasting ability (9th level, 13th level, or 17th level) to their class levels in wizard and determine their spellcasting ability accordingly. For example, a 3rd-level red ethergaunt wizard has the spellcasting ability of a 12th-level wizard.

Clerics, druids, paladins, and members of any other class or prestige class that involves channeling devotional energy or divine magic are not only unknown among ethergaunt society, but are severely persecuted as contrary to the khen-zai way of life.

Such characters would be considered traitors to their race, especially if they associated with Material Plane creatures.
 

Respect my commoners :p

Average real CR of those creatures would be around 15-20 with a few class levels and everyone could cast around level 8 spells. :]

Embrace the about 500+ 15th-50th level wizards Oerth is richer har har :p

I know I'm thredding on dangerous territory, but if the council of 8 are all epic level PL's, then almost if not all of my PL's would be epic. Hmmm, insane but I like it :p Since the council of 8 is mostly made up of wizards around 15-18th level.

Tududududududu :uhoh:
 


Serpenteye, what are level gaps for NPC`s in my faction? 7 Nosferatu Princes(some where introduced in my posts-including Lanfear Princess of The Dark Moon, Allator the Shadow Prince, Meliana Princess of The Veil, Garthaur Prince of The Flesh), most powerful children of Gallador, are Ancient category vampires, around 400-500 years old, so a level between 20-25 would make sense to me, and they also developed greater Vampire powers than the basic template shows. Below them are 30 Dukes, 120 Counts, around 300 Barons, and over 1500 Knights( at least 5th level, since this is the requirement for Vampire template).- races are mostly human and Drow, some Duergar, other humanoids are rarely made into Vampires, though Vampire Spawn is more varied.
I am going to post more info during the weekend, my studies are very demanding- but I will achieve a whole new level of power and evilness when I become a lawyer. won`t I?
 

Either that, or the ethergaunts listed in FF are only the most likely to be encountered castes of the creatures by PCs, and there would be a weaker "laborer" caste at the very least that would be making all these toys that the more powerful EGs would use and perhaps even an "outcast" caste made up of EGs that are physically incapable of embracing EG values thanks to not being "evolved" enough.
First part of this I'll argument to be untrue later this post, but the second part could very well be true about other casts, above or below the posted ones. The possibility of this is even suggested in FF itself but not elaborated on and those aren't essential in ethergaunt society or play any notable role or else they'd be listed.

But really, with no commoners or laborers and no servitor races at the least I don't understand how EG society could function. There's no mention of them true, but that's for monsters as monsters. Societies that exist as functional units in a more than rational setting than a planar enounter are more complex.
There is no sign that there aren't layers in casts. Like craftsman, diplomates, wizards, alchemists, technologists and whatever. Just which profession and function you could possibly achieve and exhibit depends on the caste you are born into. Really, how do humans function without an obvious born into caste system?:)

Personally I'd suggest that there's a CR2-4 commoner class of gray EGs out there, they'd make stuff and turn down beds and wear red shirts when required for the more important EGs. They wouldn't show up in most situations, but they'd fill in the bulk of your population as the "guys who keep the armies supplied in etherblades" and accountants and insurance salesmen. Whatever.
Distributed among the reds most likely. And you are forgetting a huge thing... They are AT LEAST 9th level wizards, they are practically BORN with 9th level spell casting capabilities. This will lead to other things as will be noted below.

You're missing a hugely important segment of your population otherwise, because nothing about extraplanar aberrations suggests that they're immune to basic needs like other creatures. So either EGs have a bulky population of "enslaved envoys" or they're not having time to gain all these levels you're talking about because they've got to personally take care of infrastructure and logistical needs themselves.
Which hardly takes any effort as will be noted below, spells solve everything.

they've got to tend to wounded somehow without healing magic by themselves, wash those masks for hygeine purposes (their Cons aren't huge), do their own plumbing, cook their own meals (or hunt them)
You do know that cantrips take care of all these things right? Presditigitation (sp?) or something its called. And even wine and excuisite cooking is merely a first level spell.

Doing all these things just takes a fraction of 6 seconds and a flick of the wrist.

make all the constructs and accoutrements of EG society...
This and the crafting of weapons, buildings and everything....? Piece of cake.

You know it takes almost a year for a human expert to make a masterwork longsword right? You know how long it takes for an ethergaunt with ranks in craft? About 6 seconds. Every ethergaunt out there is capable to cast the FABRICATE spell which allows them to create even the most difficult to create and complex items in the casting of 1 spell, that means 6 seconds. One red ethergaunt, without class levels or any additional stats or anything can create more masterwork items in 18 seconds then a human expert craftsman can in 3 years. The ammount of normal weapons one can create in 18 seconds would give you the shivers.

Personally I can't see how they'd call themselves grand titles like scout and diplomat if they're spending most of their time doing mundane things like laundry. Who has time to invade the material plane?
One red can do in a day what a human expert can do in 3 years. Makes sense now?

Conquerors normally have people who do the minor activities of life for them, and currently I don't see that you have - EGs wage genocidal on material plane inhabitants, and the castes listed are too important to bother with that junk. What gives?
If every red in my enclave fabricated for a week I'd probably have more stuff, and of masterwork quality to boot then your nation would create in a year's work. That's what gives.

This isn't even without referring to nations as Halrua, the Netherese, Thay and the Shades in the Forgotten Realms where only a handfull of people were high level wizards and even they practically had this way of life. So what gives about this?

And I'm not even considering going into the effects that the ammount of magical and technological items give to a population where everyone can create them in what did I say? 6 seconds?

Everyone in that society is bound to be immersed in magical and technological items. Not even starting on what their homes and buildings would look like with everything automatized and with magic aiding in every thinkable part of life.

Hope this explains a bit "what gives".
 


@Serpenteye: I've sent you a mail with a first rough idea how my faction could work. If it is not possible or balanced I will switch to another. Tons of ways how to use mercs.

@James Heard/The Forsaken One: By all means I do not want to get involved in this discusion, much less take a side. But don't you think you are taking this a bit serious?

Anyway, claw will gladly offer you both any troops you might ever need to bash your heads in. As long as the bill is paid it doesn't matter if your an ice gnome or a too evil invader from outer space. :)
 

Humans don't function without a caste system, our castes are just more flexible and amorphously defined. We have definite heirarchal social structures though. Masters and not masters, people who do things and people who rule.
Without that heirarchy we don't accomplish much at all.
My point exactly.

I'm not forgetting anything. I'm acknowlegding that the typical spell lists in the FF list none of the practical spells that you're claiming that the EGs have and given their nature they don't seem inclined to do chores even "at a flick of a wrist."
You seem to forget that they utterly obey orders from higher casts as well as more powerfull individuals of their own cast. So they could simply be ordered to and since higher order casts think of lower level cast like vermin, why wouldn't they order them to do such work? And we aren't even talking about the thralls at this moment.

The entire nature of the red, white, and black EGs seems to be as consumers, but you're stating that amongst those estemed roles they're also the janitors, manservants, plumbers, prostitutes or what not that go along as trappings of a master class.
The consumer image is a subjective one and your own. Not mine and not that of others I have presented this to.

As for the trappings of a master class, if you look at romans, aristocrats could give a rats $@!# about their proletarians but those did do their crap work while in the eyes of the same aristocrat the proletarians were invaluable compared to that of a slave. Being a roman in itself would place you in the masterclass / race compared to other races and societies but would say nothing about your place in your own society.

Really I can't understand how you get that image that an interspicies dominatant trait means you can't have segreggation in your own racial dispositions.

If there are no trappings of a master class then what exactly do the heirarchies of the EGs gain them
I hereby refer to the society and ethergaunt writeup, especially concerning their philosophy which you clearly skipped.

except governance over lower castes- and if reds are both the rank and file losers of the legions AND the coin of industry by which EG society revolves
Now I'm still missing where it is even remotely possible that a human society ruled by elves for example would actually be able to function in the way you describe it.

then any conflict with a force capable of inflicting casualties upon the EGs (which there certainly exist in sufficient numbers in the Ethereal) you're not only wounding the military but the support structure for the military. That is, that's a pretty stupid way of setting up your society for such smart fellows because it makes you vulnerable to disorder just by engaging in conflict at all.
This proves your appearant lack of understanding in this matter. The fact that ANY red as lowest cast member can support ITSELF as well as others and in doing so can function both as militairy unit and as support makes it LESS vulnerable then a normal society. In a normal society if the craftsman get killed their is no support for the fighters, and if the fighters are killed there is no protection or use for the supports.

In the khen-zai society you can't cripple it that way since everything is self supporting. You can't handicap society in that way since there are no real "groups" of individuals with a task that can't be easily replaced. Everyone can function in any role due to magic.

Don't forget they're wizards. They can copy any spell they might need for any task and just cast it. They aren't psions or sorcerers who are stuck with a limited amount of spells. A wizards versatility is endless, and with that an ethergaunts individual function in society.

Which EGs don't have on their spell lists at all. Create F&W is cleric only, unless you're suggesting that they're all living off of 7th level Magnificent Mansion spells. Since you have to be a 13th level Wiz to cast those, I doubt it's the reds doing it.
EG's have a wizards spell list so it is most definately in there and the spell lists in FF are EXAMPLE SPELL LISTS, thank you very much. And as we all know WotC probably didn't think of making an optimal spell list and most certainly not one that would attempt to make sense of their society now would it?

Again I refer to the fact that they are wizards who have a spell selection suited to their needs and can memmorize the specific spell for their need that day. It's plain stupid to argument that an EXAMPLE spell list from a WotC source is a solid foundation to argument which spells they use and from that argument that their society can't function lol.

Don't forget their high intelligence and wisdom scores. They will know how to make this function and be able to tell the right from the wrong choises as well.

Ow and btw, what made you think that they couldn't devellop a food creation spell? Just wondering what youre argument is gonna be about that. It would take a week to be precise. Somewhere along that 10,000 years or even before that someone might have stumbled upon that idea with 31 intelligence.

When they can do it at all, which as is clear- they can't.
It makes me laugh my ass off that you don't even seem to know that its an example spell list and wizards can just memmorize and write any spell they want to. So really, this is CLEAR they cant? really? I'm having Venuz and Ho'Skoteinos (both 3rd IR players and Venuz now 5th IR to) laughing their ass off about that.

Next you're gonna tell me that someone who can ride one car can't ride another because err....? Yeah well? Why not? So why is it so CLEARLY obvious that ethergaunts cant cast other spells? Haha can't wait to know the answer to that one.

How though? Major Creation certainly can't do it, and it's a 5th level spell and it's temporary. An awful lot of these spells that are going to provide you with societal infrastructure are a lot higher than your reds can cast normally, so that means that your whites and blacks would have to cast them - not a particularly glorious and productive way to spend your time as a master of all creation is it, spending all your most powerful magics maintaining your underlings because you don't have anyone to make goods and maintain your shelters because of your reliance on magic.
Ok I'll humor you since you didn't read my post allthough you even quoted the relevant part.

FRABRICATE

Thanks. And for those that can't cast it themselves yet (which they can so point is moot), there are always scrolls.

And again theres thralls who can potentially do this work for them.

spending all your most powerful magics maintaining your underlings because you don't have anyone to make goods
I'm quoting this again since it really gave me a good laugh and proves again that you didn't even bother to thouroughly read the racial description I posted before you started argumenting, no sorry whining as its getting more and more since I read down your post.

If you dare saying this while failing to even notice that they have an INNIATE DOMINATE MONSTER ability, I'm afraid I lost you somewhere along the way.

If he functions as a 9th level wizard he can in fact cast only six fabricate spells a day.
If you do acknowledge this why the remark above that its impossible to do with major creation? Dude I said it was fabricate that did it and you dismiss it and now use it for the sake of argumentation..... right.....

His highest level spell of the day. And to make masterwork items they'd have to invest skill points into Craft, and probably Skill Focus feats into Craft- this is your standing army right?
Yeah so some reds did that? And then what? They can craft AND fight, just like HUMAN fighters can who invested in the craft skill. How the hell can a standing army craft as well! How??? Why do fighters even get craft as a class skill rediculous! Seems your argument is that a fighter with the craft skill is useless. I can tell from my own gaming experience that it works out fine and saves tones of money at low level if you don't have to buy and can make yourself for 1/3rd the cost.

So when you need stuff, your invincible army stops and has to collect enough reds to make stuff.
They are part of the army or a set number stayes at enclaves as is plausible to work year round or half a year and work in shifts with other reds. They versatility grants them the benefit of not having to stick with one profession for your whole life and still be good at whatever you do.

And other reds have to go out and somehow collect enough base materials for Fabricate to work at all,
I don't get where the "somehow" comes from. Why not take it by force, or just trade for it? Or even have thralls mine or gather it themselves.

and if their collection efforts cause injury or death you've probably lost some other vital skill sets for the general maintenance of your forces.
As in all small societies, every loss is a great one nomatter the function of the individual. And a skill set is never vital due to the fact that they can use spells to allow them to function in any role. Or with the amount of magic available just use magic items to grant you the ranks in the skill you need. Hardly costs anything to have a +5 in a skill. That combined with the +6 racial intelligence modifier (in this case for craft) you've got a basic +10 modifier without ever having ranks in it. A human craftsman is hard pressed to get a +10 on his check.

You've got a lot of skill points with EGs, but you're still limited by HD for how many points you can allocate to skills- so your average Red will have a Craft rank of 4 I suppose, because Craft isn't a class skill for EGs.
Again you seem to make a huge mistake here. The statted ethergaunts are merely commoners. All the classes that they take, and they will since they can only advance by character class, including their favorite one have craft, alchemy, heal, and profession as class skills.

Again I don't see any merit in your argumentation.

That's only a +10 on the check,
You ever did the math it takes a human commoner or expert to get +10 on a check and how many there are of those? Thanks.... "only +10" and you're forgetting that artisan tools and a workshop add +4 in total, 1 assist from a thrall and your on +16. That + taking 10 on the craft skill grants EXCEPTIONAL ITEMS that can be made, forget the masterwork, we can do better!

so your Masterwork items dreams are a little far off the mark as far as a "simple flick of the wrist" again. Seeing how the DC is 20 I simply don't see how you're going to make up that Masterwork component all the time,
God really, why do you even try when you don't even know the game rules. With a "meager" +10 you can take 10 on the check and ALWAYS make that DC 20 check. Dude think before you start spamming this stuff, it makes no sense. A commoner red ethergaunt can ALWAYS make that masterwork component ALWAYS no chance to fail if he even only took the 4 ranks in craft from his RACIAL hitdice, not even starting on the skillranks from his class he took.

multiple spells, further weakening your army.
Yeah... weakening my army in peace time... or only a part. Again I note, a single Red can do as much work in 36 seconds a day + his 8-10 hour working day (don't know whats reasonable in this world as amounts of working hours put in but I think its more then 8 looking at our medieval times where you worked 16 hours a day) as takes 7 human or elven craftsman a full year.

AND this crafter can function as a better warrior or caster then his human or elven counterpart that functions in their standing army and that can't cast fight or craft.

It's win win.

You keep saying that, but no amount of saying that changes the rules.
And you please don't even dare to mention the rules since you clearly are to incompetent to even read them clearly. You are talking about them like you know it all while you don't even know you can take 10 on a craftskill check.

For gods sake man, drop it.

Right. Which is why they left. And came here.
Useless remark.

"Oh, and my character has ray guns and high level magic and we're really cool dudes with tentacles from another planet. And we want to eat the other players, because I've set it up so that I really have no choice but to eat other players because otherwise I don't have the infrastructure to participate in the game."
Wtf ur complaining about here? It's a choice a made, so what? If you'd have liked that playing style you'd have done it yourself. And you don't see me bitching about your playing style and your claims and choises now do you? Kinda arrogant way to view things and very egocentrical.

All those nations have a lower class of commoners though, that provide the support for their civilization. It's like pointing at actors in movies and going, "All that happens is they act. It's all easy," without acknowledging that there are hordes of unseen people that are picking up the weight of making the actors look great. If you don't have that underpining, in some fashion, you don't have a civilization and EGs are smart enough to know that- so why are you suggesting they're so stupid?
No you're stupid with forgetting that if there is so much magic to go around noone needs to do those things themselves anymore. Abeit a very small group. If you compare the amount of people concerning themselves with food production and stuff in the Netherlands where I live compared to other people it's redundant. And the ethergaunts have the luxury to have thralls do this work for them as well as their magic and the possibility to ratate the ethergaunts concerned with this task due to their inherent magical abilities.

Again you can memmorize different spells each day you know, even at different moments each day and multiple times a day to boot. Takes 15 minutes.

Yep, sure does. My opinion is even lower of the EG faction now, if that were possible.
lol thanks, to start making this personal. And don't forget this is all subjective as are all opinions concerning this stuff. It's about flavor and taste. I'm sorry you have to criticize others so much on their choises. I guess with the way your arguments and knowledge of the rules, you should be glad they aren't doing the same to you.

I should have taken the God Nucleos, the Nuclear god. Since I'd be radiation I'd be invulnerable until people researched splitting the atom, and I could give people cancer by walking across the globe. I wouldn't have to roleplay or anything, just some pronouncements of my great power and how everyone was inferior to me. Then I'd just start a'walkin' and take out nations. Cool huh?
Again, thanks for attacking me on a personal basis here, proves to kind of person you are to everyone here.

As for the rest, I'm glad to show with this to everyone else here just how intollerant you are of peoples choise and tastes if they don't stroke with your own. Its sad, pathetic and I don't even want to know which things in real life you treat the same way if people dont think similarly to you.

Honestly, your amount of consideration and acceptance of different kinds of thinking and choices scares me.

And has it occured to you that acting like that and all is roleplaying for this faction?

Thanks.
 

@James Heard/The Forsaken One: By all means I do not want to get involved in this discusion, much less take a side. But don't you think you are taking this a bit serious?
I'm just agitated by him having to take this to a personal level.

And the fact that hes acting all like he knows everything about the rules while he for crying out loud doesn't even know about being able to take 10 on a skillcheck.

Wtf is he even attempting to argue there then?

Everything he says is complete and utter :):):):):):):):) as soon as it regards the rules or anything remotely associated.

And his small perspective how things happen all at the same time and there is no other way. As well as wizards not even being able to know different spells then as listed in an example spellist.

rofl.

That guy is so full of :):):):) it's probably drooling out of his eyes, perhaps that's why he misread the rules and my post and faction description 10 times.

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Takes a deep breath, so that just had to vent there for a second. My appologies to anyone annoyed or insulted. But this totally retarded crap hes spamming and the way hes doing it annoys the crap out of me.

And if he treated me the same way on a different point he'd be plainly discriminating me, yeah, in the racist kinda way. And this is even a game so hell, I dont even want to know how he handles that stuff in real life. God, if you can't even tollerate others peoples faction claims and get that worked up about it.

lol.

And his argumentation, lol, I'm saving his and mine posts for some amusement this weekend at my gaming group.
 

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