Iron Lore: Malhavoc's Surprise?

tetsujin28 · Mar 25, 2005

Teflon Billy said:
This sounds like it is going to totally rock.

I always liked ya, Billy

tetsujin28 · Mar 25, 2005

JoeGKushner said:
Wasn't humor. I mean, how is it going to help your game if you're actively running a game now? It's some odd months down the road. Heck, I've switched campaigns and game systems in a few months time.

Exactly. Why think in terms of The Campaign That Never Ends, rather than, "This could be one frickin' cool camaign!"

Angel Tarragon · Mar 25, 2005

Despite wether the campaign sinks or swims - it sounds quite close to how I want my homebrew to be like - so I will be acquiring it. I am really liking what I am hearing about it and it sounds like it is quite customizable. It is perfect a perfect 10 on my scale [so far]!

ecliptic · Mar 25, 2005

Did I mention how I can't wait for this book.?

This is so totally going to own, and fits my homebrew world. I was working on stuff very similar to Iron Lore, even down to the one casting class so happen named Arcanist. The first thing that flashed through my mind reading about IL is that they must have spies.

A few changes such as VP/WP, and I will be good to go.

JoeGKushner · Mar 25, 2005

tetsujin28 said:
Exactly. Why think in terms of The Campaign That Never Ends, rather than, "This could be one frickin' cool camaign!"

Exactly. I'm curious to see what it's about. I've played lots of different d20 variants but I've never been one to hold up or stop my game in anticipation of some upcoming book.

If it sounds interesting, my group will probably give it a whirl. If it looks like it has to be it's own thing, then after that whirl, we'll probably go back to D&D just like we did after Grim Tales, Arcana Unearthed and Black Company.

Staffan · Mar 25, 2005

Dr. Strangemonkey said:
The DR mechanic is amazing!

While random DR is a neat solution to the problem of balancing DR so it's not pointless nor makes people invulnerable, it's not like Mearls is the first to think of it. It's been around since at least 1981 (when Stormbringer came out).

One neat aspect of it is that you can separate armor that's sorta weak but has lots of coverage (e.g. a mail hauberk) from armor that's strong but leaves lots of areas unprotected (like a breastplate). The hauberk could give a DR of something like 1d4+2, wheras the breastplate could be 1d10-1. Both would have the same average, but the hauberk's protection would be a lot more predictable.

JRRNeiklot · Mar 25, 2005

At first, I was really excited about this, but as I've read more, I'm growing increasingly less gung ho for it. Here's a few reasons why.

Point-Buy Ability Scores - I hate this. It fosters a politically correct, everyone is equal state of mind. I realize it's for game balance, so Joe doesn't have 5 18s and Tim has 5 9s for stats. But so be it, everyone is NOT created equal, else I'd be pitching for the Yankees alongside RJ.

Armor and Damage Reduction - This I like in theory, but contrarily to what Mr Mearls says, I believe it will slow game play down. It might not if the dm just rolls damage and lets the player roll his d4 or whatever, adjust the damage, and go on with play, but in my experience, whenever someone is rolling a die for any reason, play grinds to a hault while everyone watches breathlessly to see if Joe takes 5 or 6 points of damage.

Skills Matter in Combat - Again, in theory this sounds cool, but 3e combat is slow enough already. This just seems like more ways to slow it down further. Cool ways, maybe, but still.

Tokens - There are similar rules to this in many games, and I'm not fond of them. I like to let the dice fall where they may, and this seems like hedging your bets.

PCs have a heroic stature. They are stronger, smarter, and faster than normal - This I really don't like. I lie the old AD&D method, where pcs were considered no different than the ordinary Joe, except for their training. I don't want to see pcs throwing boulders and wrestling fire giants to the ground. Slaying the giant is cool, but a 6 foot human putting a giant in the camel clutch is a bit much.

That said, I do find a lot of things I like about Iron Lore, most notably the lack of having your toys define your character. I'm gonna put this one down as a "wait and see." I'll probably pick it up anyway, cuz I'm a gaming whore.

BryonD · Mar 25, 2005

Doesn't this:

JRRNeiklot said:
Point-Buy Ability Scores - I hate this. It fosters a politically correct, everyone is equal state of mind. I realize it's for game balance, so Joe doesn't have 5 18s and Tim has 5 9s for stats. But so be it, everyone is NOT created equal, else I'd be pitching for the Yankees alongside RJ.

Pretty much contradict this:

PCs have a heroic stature. They are stronger, smarter, and faster than normal - This I really don't like. I lie the old AD&D method, where pcs were considered no different than the ordinary Joe, except for their training.

So you want a game where everyone is not created equal, but none of them are different than the ordinary Joe? :\

JRRNeiklot · Mar 25, 2005

Didn't say I didn't want them different. But there should be a line that pcs can't cross by ordinary means, I.E., magic. Lifting a 400 pound boulder is fine, a 2 ton boulder is not. Walking a tight rope is fine, swimming up a waterfall is not. You get the picture.

BryonD · Mar 25, 2005

I'm not sure I've seen anything to imply that Iron Lore will let you swim up a waterfall. Maybe it will, but I haven't seen it yet and that type of action is not typical of the fantasy inspirations referenced.

Of course a system that handles larger than life at low level and swimming up waterfalls at level 25 is best of both worlds, just play in your comfort range.

Of course your comments still contradict. If some characters are you and others are RJ, then they both can not be average Joe.