Raven Crowking
First Post
buzz said:
True. I'm simply spouting off...er.....stating my opinion.
Is gaming *with* a map and minis really bad?
True. I'm simply spouting off...er.....stating my opinion.
The_Gneech
Explorer
Love maps! Love minis!
Started without them 'cause I couldn't afford them. Then one day (loooooooong ago) Steve Jackson Games published Cardboard Heroes and Yea! Verily! All was right with the world!
I can game without them if I must -- but in the back of my mind I'm always wishing they were there.
The one exception is for slap-happy things like Toon or Teenagers From Outer Space. In that case, the action is so loose and over-the-top that minis and a map couldn't possibly capture it and it would be pointless to try. But for more "serious" games, yah, map and minis all the way, please and thank you!
Scenery pieces? BIG PLUS POINTS!
-The Gneech
Started without them 'cause I couldn't afford them. Then one day (loooooooong ago) Steve Jackson Games published Cardboard Heroes and Yea! Verily! All was right with the world!
I can game without them if I must -- but in the back of my mind I'm always wishing they were there.
The one exception is for slap-happy things like Toon or Teenagers From Outer Space. In that case, the action is so loose and over-the-top that minis and a map couldn't possibly capture it and it would be pointless to try. But for more "serious" games, yah, map and minis all the way, please and thank you!
Scenery pieces? BIG PLUS POINTS!
-The Gneech
I think maps (even if hand-drawn) and some sort of tokens are pretty essential to the tactical aspects of D&D 3.x combat. Formal battlemaps and minis are nice to have, even if I've never really cared about minis enough to buy any (so the mini for my PC often ends being the wrong class, race, or gender).
Toscadero
Explorer
I've been gaming for 27 years. We started with using dice, bottlecaps, etc to mark a space on the table. Everything from cups, books and keys have been used to mark terrain. Can you play without minis? Of course! Our group has always liked to see exactly where they are in combat. We now use mats, 3-D Hirst Arts and Dwarven Forge Terrain. We ran Monte Cook's Banewarrens using maps someone else had made available on the web. These were projected onto the table top with a hanging DLP projector. That being said, there are always those nights when we just resort to using dice, bottlecaps, etc., but we always use something. Sometimes it has been as simple as a 8x11 sheet of paper with numbers saying you are here.
IanB said:
Eh, it's not that hard. We use minis for positioning, but don't use a grid (and, really, I'm only still using the minis because my players like them, not because we need them for combat). You have to be wary for the "judgement call" conditions like flanking or AoO stuff, but as long as the players trust the DM to not be screwing them over, things work out well.
I moved away from the grid because the tactical movement was slowing the game down for my group, and my players agreed that they were thinking too much about how to move their minis and not enough on visualizing the battlefield. It works out pretty well because we only really have one "melee type" character and his player is more concerned with coming up with graphic descriptions of the damage he does with his battle axe than with figuring out the best tactical plan of attack. With a different group and different player types, I'd probably go back to the battlemat, but with this group it just works out better to run combat a bit more abstractly.
Jeff Wilder
First Post
I've loved battlemats and minis throughout my D&D career, and I've played since blue-box Basic. I very much doubt that I'll ever go back to playing without them, and in fact if I ever run Shadowrun again, I'll almost certainly use a mat and minis..
That said, there's a lot of validity in the assertion that (especially in 3.X) the battlemat and minis shape expectations and behavior in such a way that combat becomes largely rote and mechanical. "I five-foot step to swing. I miss. Next."
This can be overcome, however, if the DM and players make the effort, and the effort is well worthwhile for the other benefits that a mat and minis bring to the game.
That said, there's a lot of validity in the assertion that (especially in 3.X) the battlemat and minis shape expectations and behavior in such a way that combat becomes largely rote and mechanical. "I five-foot step to swing. I miss. Next."
This can be overcome, however, if the DM and players make the effort, and the effort is well worthwhile for the other benefits that a mat and minis bring to the game.
thedungeondelver
Adventurer
teitan said:
My group is going to start the "Giants" series soon.
I'll get some snaps when they reach Nosnra's hall.
RSKennan
Explorer
I don't like minis. It's not because I think they limit everyone's imagination, but because they limit mine. Some use minis to bring them closer to the action in the game world (and some people don't want to be brought closer to the game world at all).
As for me, minis distance me from the action. In a narrative structure, I have no trouble seeing through the eyes of my npcs or monsters, and visualizing the action. It all feels very dynamic, and I do my best GMing. I think it's because when narrating, I lose contact with my surroundings and stare off into the middle distance, where I see the action as it plays out. It's like Stephen King's bit in Misery about "looking through the hole in the page".
When I see a battlemat with minis, my imagination comes to a full stop at the board. It doesn't come to life in the same way. All I see are the physical representations. My GMing suffers, and I haven't run a truly excellent combat-heavy game of D&D since 3.x came out. I used to consider myself a very good GM, but nowadays, I'm mediocre. I wish I knew how to get over it. Any suggestions?
As for me, minis distance me from the action. In a narrative structure, I have no trouble seeing through the eyes of my npcs or monsters, and visualizing the action. It all feels very dynamic, and I do my best GMing. I think it's because when narrating, I lose contact with my surroundings and stare off into the middle distance, where I see the action as it plays out. It's like Stephen King's bit in Misery about "looking through the hole in the page".
When I see a battlemat with minis, my imagination comes to a full stop at the board. It doesn't come to life in the same way. All I see are the physical representations. My GMing suffers, and I haven't run a truly excellent combat-heavy game of D&D since 3.x came out. I used to consider myself a very good GM, but nowadays, I'm mediocre. I wish I knew how to get over it. Any suggestions?
