Is it common for players to powergame?

[Oryan77]

Start reading the Forgotten Realms D&D books. 50 is conservative.

The only FR series I've read are the Drizzt novels. Drizzt himself is about ECL 18 or so and only has around half a dozen magic items. At least less than a dozen. None of the other characters are mentioned as having lots of items. Even Jarlaxle has maybe two dozen items at most....but again, he's around ECL 22. When you mention 50 items being conservative in FR books, you must be talking about epic level characters? Remember, I'm talking about a 5th lvl PC here.

My player is ECL 5. It can't possibly be normal for a 5th lvl PC to already have powerful mounts AND dozens of magic items without it being a Monty Hall game can it? If I put all of the character wealth into just giving him a flying mount, I can see that making sense. But that's not the case. A PC obtaining something like a flying mount at 5th lvl seems extreme to me. Several lvls higher seems right, but 5th lvl?

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

A Song of Ice and Fire. Dragons and a giant elk.

Oh...so *that* is where the megaloceros came from.

I wasn't entirely sure why the Knights of the Iron Glacier really needed to ride dire(-ish) elk, but that reminds me of why.

Brad

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Oryan77, it was my belief that you were using hyperbole when you mentioned 50 different types of magic items, and that your core issue was with "standard" D&D's amount of loot. That you learned D&D playing in a low magic world, and prefer that. You then commented that your fantasy literature background seemed to indicate that "standard D&D" is not the norm, but rather that fantasy novels usually paint a more low-magic scenario.

My response was to your comments about fantasy literature. I wanted to show you that both plenty of magic items (Forgotten Realms) and fantastic mounts (various other series,) are quite prevalent in fantasy fiction.

I did not mean to claim that dozens of magic items and flying mounts are the norm at level 5. I didn't think you meant that either (see above comment about hyperbole.)

So clearly, we're not on the same page here. Let me start over with what I'm thinking.

1. "Lots of items and fantastic mounts" are alive and well in fantasy literature. There's certainly a precedent for wanting a flying horse, or hippogriff, or dragon as your mount. And there's a precedent (albeit, for the most part, within the D&D family of novels,) for lots of magic items in fantasy writing as well.

2. At 5th-level a PC is going to have a few magic items. If he's a paladin or druid he'll have a special mount, though it's too early for the flying options. If a PC pools all his wealth, he might be able to afford a hippogriff mount, though that would leave him dangerously underequipped in many other situations.

3. I agree that having, literally, dozens of magic items and a flying mount at level 5 is well within the range of Monty Haul.

 

[Oryan77]

Ok, whew. I must not have been very clear before. I understand there's "goodies" in fantasy novels. I was just referring to the characters in the novels having moderate amounts for their "level". I was just comparing my 5th lvl players to a novels powerful characters like Drizzt and company and saying that not even Drizzt & Co. are all decked out in "50" magic items (I was of course exagerating) and flying mounts, and they are very powerful people. So I was shocked when you said it's normal for novels to equip characters with so much. I understand epic characters having lots of goodies; I was referring to the 5th lvl PC in my game though.

Ok, so it is unrealistic in D&D for a 5th lvl PC to already have a flying mount; unless all of his wealth went into obtaining that mount. And even then it'll be a low-end mount. For a bit there I was afraid that I was even more stingy with goodies in my game than I thought. So this reinforces my belief that my player is powergaming and it's not just me being stingy.

This thread helped a lot. I've already learned a few things and have come up with ideas to help curb this player from powergaming in my campaign. I think he's used to playing with DMs that encouraged his powergaming. I'll just need to try and get him to lower his expectations a bit. He wants too much too soon. The good thing is that he seems willing to make an effort to do that.