Is it just me, or is evil winning in the Forgotten Realms?

[Brakkart]

I mean I have pretty much all the 3E stuff for Fr (missing CotSQ only) and I read a lot of the novels and I can't help but feel that the bad guys really do seem to have turned the tide from the 2E days of them being laughed at by Eliminster etc, and their plots always failing. Here a few examples of what I mean:

1. The Shadow Theives are back in Waterdeep.
2. The Lords of Waterdeep have been infiltrated by Hlaavin of the Unseen! (REALLY didn't see that one coming).
3. The Zhents/Banites are stronger than ever.
4. The Red Wizards now have a vast source of funds for their reasearchs and to pay for the construction of minions (golems ain't cheap, especially those gemstone ones of theirs).
5. The Cult of Dragon wreaks unholy hell on Faerun in the Year of Rogue Dragons, creating many new Dracoliches and destroying a lot of lives/property. Even if the overall plan of Sammasters gets stopped, the damage done in the meantime is immense.
6. The drow are taking Cormanthor, waging war on the dales, and are virtually unoppossed in doing so.
7. Cormyr after wars against the goblins, Ghazneths and Shades is teetering on the brink of collapse.
8. The Phaerimm are loose, granted their numbers took a hammering in their battles against Shade and Evereska.
9. Amn is overrun with monsters and Cyricists.
10. The sarrukh have awakened from their long hibernation and as a result their Yuan-ti and Naga servants have never been more active.

Not sure what other signs there are, or maybe I'm just reading things wrong, but it sure seems to me like evil seems to be in the ascendant right now.

 

[reiella]

The Roll of Years predicted much of it though.

As a boon, it does make for a more interesting campaign world to be a player in. After all, there's a bunch of stuff going on to keep the Big Guys busy, so you can feel significant in your slice of the world.

 

[The Grumpy Celt]

8. The Phaerimm are loose, granted their numbers took a hammering in their battles against Shade and Evereska.

In my game, I'm gonna have some phaerimm let themselves get eaten by Deepspawn (so it starts making them) and then in a seperate incident a flesh-eating zombie plague spreads accross the land as Sembia attacks and tries to take over Cormyr and Baldurs Gate wages war on the heart lands and Calim and Memmon are freed while the terrasque is freed.

And Khelben kills the Paladinson.

 

[Desdichado]

"Dark" is all the rage these days. 2e FR ambience was also governed by the "What Would Mommy Think?" attitude of TSR too--if I remember correctly, the ineffectiveness of FR villains is directly correlated to that phenomena and I think I've read quotes that say that specifically from in-house designers of the time. If I remember correctly.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

I had much the same impression when I first read the 3e campaign setting.

I didn't think of it so much as a darkening of the Realms, but of recognizing the need for newer, stronger villains. There's only so much fighting the Zhentarim that can keep people's attention.

Heroes are defined by the villains they fight, and I thought that a lot of the point of 3e FR was to emphasize the need for new heroes (i.e. the PCs), since there are more villains than ever and a lot of the older heroes are gone / less effectual.

 

[wingsandsword]

"Dark" is all the rage these days. 2e FR ambience was also governed by the "What Would Mommy Think?" attitude of TSR too--if I remember correctly, the ineffectiveness of FR villains is directly correlated to that phenomena and I think I've read quotes that say that specifically from in-house designers of the time. If I remember correctly.

Yeah, I remember that the big ads for 3e Forgotten Realms had a picture of a menacing looking red wizard (the same art they later put in the 3.5 DMG I think) and a tagline of "Evil is everywhere, and it's spreading". For a long time, the villains of the Realms were inept almost to the point of comedy. The Thayans would begin yet another predictable military campaign and be thwarted almost like clockwork. The Cult of the Dragon sat around doing dark rituals, but not too much happened, and a nice big stable of famous NPC's came around for the regularly scheduled thwarting of the villains.

Now they killed off Azoun, have some of the big names retiring or semi-retiring from old age, or having their own political problems of being major national leaders coming up. It gives more room for PC's to work with, and the villains aren't constrained by the goody-two-shoes TSR mentality, which made it all seem reminiscent of the old Comics Code (could you imagine TSR publishing the BoVD, or putting in Realms-specific Vile material into the PGtF?).

So yes, evil is winning now, but they haven't been allowed to before. Eventually the good guys will pull it out, more or less, but evil is being allowed to be Evil, and good guys are being allowed to make mistakes.

 

[Blackthorne]

Honestly, this is one of the best ideas WotC ever had. The 3E FRCS restored my faith.

 

[rogueattorney]

2e FR ambience was also governed by the "What Would Mommy Think?" attitude of TSR too--if I remember correctly, the ineffectiveness of FR villains is directly correlated to that phenomena and I think I've read quotes that say that specifically from in-house designers of the time. If I remember correctly.

This is true. There was a memo sent around TSR in the early 90's that surfaced on the 'Net over the last 5 years or so, basically saying just this, that evil must never be shown in a positive light and so on. Nice for the mommies, but made for some pretty banal gaming products.

R.A.

 

[LoneWolf23]

Not sure what other signs there are, or maybe I'm just reading things wrong, but it sure seems to me like evil seems to be in the ascendant right now.

That's what we like to call a "Target-Rich Environment"...

Mind you, I don't play in the Realms myself...

 

[Len]

That's what we like to call a "Target-Rich Environment"...

In other words, if evil is winning it's your fault. Your party needs to kill more villains.