Is this "Fair" - Part II

[spectre72]

Since the discussion about the trap turning the monk into a pile of dust has prompted many questions in my mind about the various styles of play that I had to ask a couple of other questions.

A low level party (1st level average) is traveling to the Keep on the Borderlands through the hills and the DM rolls on the wandering monster charts and rolls for a Hill Giant.

The party of 1st level characters hears a rumbling sound and only one character hides in the woods, the rest stay to fight whatever is coming because the GM would never challenge them with something they couldn't handle.

Is the encounter "Fair"

 

[Lockridge]

My own opinion is that its fair as long as the PCs have a chance to escape after they see that its a hill giant. (or if they've been given the opportunity to find out but didn't take it such as by sending a scout).
Forcing the players to fight the hill giant without an escape option would be unfair and unfun. But if the players choose to fight then thats their own fault.

 

[joshuakanton]

Yes, the encounter is fair. The character’s had an escape route and choose to stay and fight, thus Darwin’s Law kicks in and the strongest and smartest characters will survive.

 

[seskis281]

Throwing something at PCs at early level that they should run from is never a bad idea - as long (IMHO) as it's not an every session kind of thing. The post above about making sure they have options for evasion is important. Now if your group wants to charge in screaming "I'm the king of the world...." - well, that's a lesson.

I did one game where on the way to their first encounter the group encountered some bad ass Trolls and two decided "let's get 'em!" New characters joined the party soon after, but the players were a little more careful.

The reason you don't want to do it too much is that characters can get in a "defensive" mode - another game I ran saw the characters camping for a week outside a well entrance to an underground cavern, trying to throw everything they could down it to kill anything before they descended - REALLY slowed play down and I had to improvise a kidnapping of an NPC to get them in gear.

 

[Gold Roger]

What Lockridge said. A rumbling could be anything, but once you see that giant, you better run (though if someone mistakes it for an ogre things could get messy).

 

[BlackMoria]

Fair game. The party had options open to them. They were not railroaded into the encounter (as in, something they could not avoid and had to confront). If they see the giant and still decide to engage.....well, sometimes you're the dog and sometime you're the hydrant ....

 

[Barak]

Amusingly, an overwhelming encounter at somewhat higher levels should be more dangerous.

1st level characters should be wary of a rumble no matter what.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

That reminds me of why I hate random encounters. And a note to the DM, an encounter, even a random one, doesn't have to involve combat. If the PCs just attacked the giant though, they deserve what they get.

It's probably metagaming, but I have a rough idea of the CR of every creature in the MM. So if I see a giant, I know that my 1st-level character can't take them on. And, of course, you need a reason to attack.

 

[T. Foster]

Totally fair, IMO. Even if the party doesn't hide from the giant (and IMO 1st level parties should hide from just about every random encounter, especially ones that "sound big") there's no reason they have to fight the giant -- they can run from it, or try to bargain or negotiate with it. If they do choose to attack it (especially if they do so relying on metagame knowledge that the DM wouldn't throw an unbeatable monster at them) then they deserve what they get. (I don't consider it metagaming to realize that a hill giant is too tough for a 1st level party to reasonably expect to defeat in combat -- if for some reason this was a group of absolute newbie players who honestly didn't know that giants are tough, I'd expect the DM to emphasize in the description how big and tough-looking it is, and hope the players are sharp enough to take the hint).

 

[Zen]

Doesn't it say in the DMG somewhere that one out of every 20 encounters should be so far out of the party's CR as to be 'overwhelming?'

Flee the Hill Giant and the nexy 19 battles should be a breeze.

Fair.

--Z