Is Wall of Thorns as utterly broken as it seems to be?

[IcyCool]

Just a quote for those folks who believe that slashing, piercing, or bludgeoning damage dealt by a spell bypasses damage reduction. This quote doesn't disprove that position, but it is interesting.

Invocation of the Knife: Beginning at 2nd level, Daggerspell mages develop a strong mystical connection between their arcane spellcasting abilities and the daggers that they wield. Whenever a daggerspell mage casts an arcane spell that deals energy damage, he can turn half of the damage dealt by the spell into magic slashing damage rather than energy damage. Energy resistance does not apply to this damage, but damage reduction might. This power does not affect a creature's ability to resist the affected spell with a saving throw or spell resistance.
Using this ability does not require an action; its use is part of the action required to cast the affected spell. Only spells with a duration of instantaneous can be modified by this ability.

Emphasis mine.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

How, honestly, is this spell more overpowered than Web (which is a 2nd level spell), connsidering this is a 5th?

1. You can keep trying to get out of a web with no ill consequences if you fail your roll. The thorns damage you when you do anything in them (successful or not).

2. You have to have walls or trees or somesuch to anchor a web to, you can create a block of thorns in the middle of anywhere.

3. You can use a DEX or a STR roll to get out of a web vs. STR only to move through thorns.

4. You only need DC10 to move around in a web once you are unstuck, you need DC25 to move around in the block of thorns.

5. You get a 20' radius glob of web regardless of what level you are. You get 2 10X10X10 cubes of thorn per level, with a minimum of 18 of the suckers.

Very different!
DS

 

[JiffyPopTart]

No one had a DD, eh? That must have been a fun moment.

I had to fudge a little bit to keep the party rogue alive. He was hiding under a desk when the baddie cast it. The desk area was where the baddie was standing so he left that little alcove free of thorns (although the way out of the room was blocked by the mass of thorns).

I had to somehow pretend that over the course of 1+ hours the baddie who was stuck in a little 10X10 area with a desk in it never thought to look under the desk and the rogue was completely silent and unmoving the whole time.

The baddie was a half-dragon sorcerer who would have eaten the rogue for breakfast.

I have a sort-of-standing rule that I only let the PC's die in climactic battles or when they do something stupid. After the spell was cast I decided it was stupid on MY part for bringing that combat to a 1 hour pause while everyone stood around and that the best way I could deal was to "fast forward" time and continue the battle.

D "Wall of Thorns ruined my encounter" S

 

[IcyCool]

1. You can keep trying to get out of a web with no ill consequences if you fail your roll. The thorns damage you when you do anything in them (successful or not).

2. You have to have walls or trees or somesuch to anchor a web to, you can create a block of thorns in the middle of anywhere.

3. You can use a DEX or a STR roll to get out of a web vs. STR only to move through thorns.

4. You only need DC10 to move around in a web once you are unstuck, you need DC25 to move around in the block of thorns.

5. You get a 20' radius glob of web regardless of what level you are. You get 2 10X10X10 cubes of thorn per level, with a minimum of 18 of the suckers.

Very different!
DS

I just wanted to point out two things (perspective-wise):

1. Web is a 2nd level spell, Wall of thorns is a 5th level spell. Wall of thorns should be better than Web. By a lot.

2. I'm fairly certain that the volume that web can cover (if you could get a whole sphere of it) is around 33,500 cubic feet. Cut that in half, and you get 16,750, just a little under the 18,000 cubic feet that you get with a minimal casting of Wall of Thorns.

 

[Squire James]

It is my opinion that they mismatched the DC. The save DC of a 5th level spell is normally less than 25, and here the spell is wanting an ABILITY check that high! I think the DC 25 was originally thought to be a save or skill check, but they couldn't think of what it would be so they fell back to a Strength check.

A DC 18 Str check or DC 28 Escape Artist check should do the trick. Their movement's pretty restrictive even if they make the roll.

 

[Jhulae]

I just wanted to point out two things (perspective-wise):

1. Web is a 2nd level spell, Wall of thorns is a 5th level spell. Wall of thorns should be better than Web. By a lot.

2. I'm fairly certain that the volume that web can cover (if you could get a whole sphere of it) is around 33,500 cubic feet. Cut that in half, and you get 16,750, just a little under the 18,000 cubic feet that you get with a minimal casting of Wall of Thorns.

Exactly my point, Icy.