It’s LAUNCH DAY For The Pathfinder 2 Playtest!

Today’s the day! You can now download the Pathfinder 2nd Edition playtest book!

Head on over to Paizo.com to download it for free.

Its tinged with a little sadness for those of us who preordered the hard copy, as issues with Amazon means that our copies have been delayed by an indefinite amount.

’’When Paizo was planning this year's Pathfinder Playtest, we expected to exceed our own ability to fulfill orders on a timely basis, so we decided to use Fulfillment by Amazon. Unfortunately, Amazon's reports indicate that most customers will not be receiving their orders by tomorrow's release date. They shipped 3 orders on July 28, 3 more on July 29, and no orders on July 30 or 31. Today, they have shipped almost 10% of the outstanding orders, and they are continuing to ship through the night and into tomorrow. They have so far been unable to tell us when they will complete shipping.”

However, at least the PDFs are still available for free in the meantime.

Adventure chapters are also available alongside the rule book, with the first being available today. They are as follows:

1. The Lost Star, Aug 7 - Aug 26 (Also available at Gen Con on Aug 2.)
2. In Pale Mountain’s Shadow, Aug 7 - Sep 9
3. Affair At Sombrefell Hall, Sep 10 - Sep 23
4. The Mirrored Moon, Sep 24 - Oct 8
5. The Heroes Of Undarin, Oct 9 - Oct 21
6. Red Flags, Oct 22 - Nov 4
7. When The Stars Go Dark, Nov 5 - Nov 18

 

[TwoSix]

Put simply, they've changed the entire texture of combat. Attacks of Opportunity are limited to fighters and five foot step is no longer possible along with a full round action or three action equivalent. I and most of the people I play with like that interaction, so we're all put off by the new edition from the start. It seems like an innocuous change, but to those that prefer it, it is in fact monumental. The edition change is meant to cater to casual gamers. It's just depressing to me. I'm just focusing on collected the best of the third party content out there before it disappears.

Wait. You....like...full round actions?

 

[mewzard]

Put simply, they've changed the entire texture of combat. Attacks of Opportunity are limited to fighters and five foot step is no longer possible along with a full round action or three action equivalent. I and most of the people I play with like that interaction, so we're all put off by the new edition from the start. It seems like an innocuous change, but to those that prefer it, it is in fact monumental. The edition change is meant to cater to casual gamers. It's just depressing to me. I'm just focusing on collected the best of the third party content out there before it disappears.

Actually, Attacks of Opportunities aren't just limited to Fighters. Fighters are just the only class that gets them by default. I definitely saw AoO as a feat option for Paladins while reading that.

As for "Full-Round Actions", you can absolutely attack three times in a row (four if hasted) with decreasing chances to hit ala your traditional Pathfinder, you just aren't stuck only doing so. You can move and then attack twice (three times for Hasted), your Monk hasted with Flurry of Blows can end up getting five attacks, IIRC. Or, use your hasted action to shift. Monks have a high level feat that let them have a permanent action for movement purposes.

This new system lets you do that old stuff with new options. With the three action economy, you can end up casting a two-action and one action spell in a round. You can use your reaction for a lot of things. Counterspell is now a lot more viable now that you don't have to prep it and hope for the best. There are ways to get additional reactions, if that's not enough (especially for the Fighter).

With the new skill feat mechanics and how they can use ritual spells so long as they know the ritual and have a high enough ability in the appropriate skill, martials have the opportunities to do a lot more than the past system allowed.

I'm also really partial to the current weapon system, how diverse each one is, what attributes they have, their increase to dice number rather than +X for plusses to the weapon.

Just some amazing stuff.

 

[Arakasius]

Put simply, they've changed the entire texture of combat. Attacks of Opportunity are limited to fighters and five foot step is no longer possible along with a full round action or three action equivalent. I and most of the people I play with like that interaction, so we're all put off by the new edition from the start. It seems like an innocuous change, but to those that prefer it, it is in fact monumental. The edition change is meant to cater to casual gamers. It's just depressing to me. I'm just focusing on collected the best of the third party content out there before it disappears.

Wow you like the five foot shuffle of PF1? That’s surprising since no one I play with likes it. The whole get into position and then never move because you’re 1) afraid to get attacked and 2) don’t want to give up full attacks was the worst part of PF1. It turned batttles into slog fests where movement was awful. It also made martial disparity much more a thing since melee were disproportionately punished for moving.

 

[Arakasius]

I’m also likely going to convert our current level 11 PF2 game to PF2. Interesting to see how it works. Converting our spec and Druid are easy, but oracle and paladin/fighter will be a bit harder. I’ll find out what parts need changing then, but right now I really like the base chassis being proposed.

 

[trancejeremy]

Realistically, the differences between 0e through 2e (including basic) were details about the classes. In the latter days of 2e, there were compilations of spells and magic items from all the previous editions. And some of the 2e splatbooks had the 1e classes as options. The power level of monsters was another thing that varied, but that was also tied into the varying power of character classes in each edition. Even so, they all used the same basic scale for stats so using a BX module with AD&D was no problem.

2e to 3e was a pretty big change. Classes did resemble their 2e versions to a degree, like fighters to hit increased by one per level. Feats seemed to be a lot like fighting styles or weapon proficiencies found in one of the compete books. Armor class was still generally from 10 to -10 (or 10 to 30). Probably the biggest difference was the change at 10th level, characters kept getting more hit dice, which means people had a lot of hit points and thus monsters had lots and lots. But in many cases you could run low level 3e modules with 2e/earlier systems using the 3e stat blocks for monsters.

This seems to have fundamental changes to most systems found in 3e, so I think the change from 3e to 4e or 5e is probably the closest analogy. I don't see how PF2 is even slightly compatible with PF1 (or 3.x) other than in the sense 4e or 5e or 1e is.

For instance, armor class seems difference. Chain mail provides a +6 AC bonus in PF1, while here it's only +4. Max Dexterity bonuses are different. After a quick perusal, I have no idea how attack bonuses work in PF2. Actually, the playtest book is hard to decode, reminds me of the old Star Fleet Battles books

 

[mewzard]

After a quick perusal, I have no idea how attack bonuses work in PF2. Actually, the playtest book is hard to decode, reminds me of the old Star Fleet Battles books

1d20+level+proficiency rank+Strength (or Dex where appropriate)+Weapon's item bonus

So basically, like everyone has full BAB, but you factor in how proficient one is with a weapon (-2 for Untrained, +0 for Trained, +1 for Expert, +2 for Master, +3 for Legendary). It might also factor in the weapon's quality, but I can't remember off the top of my head.

 

[CapnZapp]

I see. But what you are calling "super-cluttery complex" I see as "rich and tactically satisfying". Paizo stated "making NPCs will be easier" as a design goal. They didn't say they would build to the kind of disparity you're seeking, but there are other games that do go that route. FantasyCraft comes to mind.

Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying.

Paizo's claims about easier NPCs still is a far cry from easy NPCs.

Why are you bringing up other games. I want to discuss D&D and play D&D and Pathfinder is very much a D&D game. You go play those other games.

 

[CapnZapp]

Put simply, they've changed the entire texture of combat. Attacks of Opportunity are limited to fighters and five foot step is no longer possible along with a full round action or three action equivalent. I and most of the people I play with like that interaction, so we're all put off by the new edition from the start. It seems like an innocuous change, but to those that prefer it, it is in fact monumental. The edition change is meant to cater to casual gamers. It's just depressing to me. I'm just focusing on collected the best of the third party content out there before it disappears.

Calling PF2 casual... I'm impressed.

Anyway most people intensely dislike the static combats that result from having to choose between moving and attacking, so yeah, what's a bug to you is a feature to others.

5E simply made movement free - very welcome and easy if you ask me. Not sure how PF2 does it.

 

[TwoSix]

Calling PF2 casual... I'm impressed.

Anyway most people intensely dislike the static combats that result from having to choose between moving and attacking, so yeah, what's a bug to you is a feature to others.

5E simply made movement free - very welcome and easy if you ask me. Not sure how PF2 does it.

Moving your speed costs 1 action, as does taking a 5ft step to avoid AoOs. There are quite a few feats that let you bundle combinations of movements and other actions into one action, though.

 

[Azgulor]

Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying.

Paizo's claims about easier NPCs still is a far cry from easy NPCs.

Why are you bringing up other games. I want to discuss D&D and play D&D and Pathfinder is very much a D&D game. You go play those other games.

You do realize that FantasyCraft is "very much a D&D game" too, right? The intention of "bringing up other games" was to provide information you might find helpful. Play whatever you like. And the way NPCs work in Starfinder, and will likely work in PF2, I DO find to be easy.

Oh, wait....I see. You weren't really looking to discuss crunchy PC vs. light NPC, you wanted to knock PF2 for not doing something that Paizo never claimed it would do. Got it.