Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Well I think WotC has seen it. What remains to be seen is where the new players’ preferences lean.
D&D (2024) It feels so much like the D&D Next playtest did
- Thread starter Charlaquin
- Start date
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
I wonder how much they monitor/lurk on 5e forums/discussion sites and where they do it.
TerraDave
5ever, or until 2024
The one things that turns "new players" into "grognards" is a new edition.
But, they will accept some changes, just look at ENWorld. We have some of the crustiest grognards around! Yet we have, in the end, accepted one new edition after another.
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
But this is the first "edition change" with such a large, young player base with modern social media. That makes it inherently more unstable than even past "edition wars", because there's more people involved, they're less accustomed to these kinds of changes in a game (because 5e has been the most stable edition in decades), and social media changes a ton of stuff.
I may be wrong and they might end up accepting the new changes, but just recently I saw a post with about 6 thousand upvotes that was complaining about three things "changed" in this UA that were complete misreadings of the UA.
Misinformation spreads a lot faster on social media (especially Reddit) than sites like ENWorld. Misinformation could kill this playtest if thousands of players respond negatively to the playtest because of an incorrect post on Reddit or Youtube that gained popularity.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
What were the things they said changed?
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
1) Bards can always seduce dragons because Natural 20 means automatic success (ignoring the fact that a DM doesn't call for a d20 Test unless there's a chance of success)
2) Class-specific spells are gone
3) A complete misunderstanding of critical hit changes
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Ah. Out of context this comes across to me more as a hyperbolic expression of displeasure with the change than a misunderstanding. But if that’s a common sentiment among newer players I’m surprised! I would have expected a lot more to be happy with it. I’m not too bothered either way, the difference this change will make to my games will probably not even be noticeable.
Oh, yeah, that’s a fairly understandable misreading given that you’d have to watch the video to know classes are probably going to have other ways of gaining spells. On the bright side, this misunderstanding is likely to be dispelled quickly. But hopefully WotC will learn from this that the context needs to go in the packet not just in a video.
Yeah, that makes sense as it’s the most clickbait-y change. I saw a thumbnail in my YouTube recommended feed with “One D&D” and “DMs can’t crit anymore?!” on it; if that kind of sensationalist stuff is someone’s source of information, they’re likely to badly misunderstand what the packet actually says. I am 100% certain the crit change is going to get shot down in the survey.
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
That post had 6000 karma last I checked. So, at least 6,000 people "upvoted" it. That probably doesn't mean much, but it's still spreading misinformation that could cause people to answer the survey while not fully informed of what the change is for.
Yeah, but it also shows how a lot of D&D players will take a mechanic out of context without doing more research to learn why the change is being made and what it does.
WotC definitely needs to be more transparent in future documents about what exactly is changing and what it does, or else there will be more problems like this for every playtest document that comes out.
Yep. Which I find disappointing and confirms my suspicions that a lot of the major changes will be denied a proper chance because people didn't bother to playtest with them and were only told about the change through a clickbait video or post online.
I'm not sure if I should provide any feedback as I do not plan to operate in the 5e space, and if I do it will probably be through Level Up 5e or as a player.
But it is going to be interesting to see how much things ultimately contrast between playtest and release. My understanding and everything I have read suggests DnD Next would a better game than the one ultimately released; while the feedback for Pathfinder 2e resulted in a vastly better game on release.
I hope 5.5e cribs and learns from other rpgs like Level Up 5e and Pathfinder 2e and the playtest results in a stronger game.
But it is going to be interesting to see how much things ultimately contrast between playtest and release. My understanding and everything I have read suggests DnD Next would a better game than the one ultimately released; while the feedback for Pathfinder 2e resulted in a vastly better game on release.
I hope 5.5e cribs and learns from other rpgs like Level Up 5e and Pathfinder 2e and the playtest results in a stronger game.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
I think PF2’s playtesting worked out better because its designers had a stronger design vision for the game than 5e’s did. Paizo knew what they were aiming to make, they knew what they needed feedback on, and they built the playtest to focus on those specific things. Whereas D&D Next was just wild experimentation trying to figure out what their audience wanted.
This time around, I get the impression that WotC knows what they want to make, and for the most part they’re just going to make that. But they also know what parts of it their audience is most likely to reject, and are prepared to cut them. But first they want to pitch those parts to the audience, just in case some of them do actually get accepted.
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