D&D General It's not a video game.

[iserith]

I've had lots of players play in modules I'm running that they've read or played in before or read about on the internet. It's never been an issue. I change some things, but not a lot (depending on the module), just enough to be able to say - and sometimes prove - that making assumptions is dangerous.

If they know there's a dragon somewhere in the lower levels or that the good treasure is hidden behind the secret door in Area 25, that's really not a problem for me. It's a bit of a running joke in my games that a player will say something about a monster's abilities or the like and add "...or so I read in my grandpa's journal." We even have a custom Discord reaction for it.

 

[TheAlkaizer]

That is not exactly what the OP is talking about. The OP mentioned the Player trying to find out what actually happens later in the adventure so they can use that knowledge to beat it.

Ah, I reread the post more carefully and you're right. I think stuff like "optimizing against devils" and "help build a cool characters" can fall under my post. But stuff like "which adventure gives better loot" and questions about overcoming specific challenge in a specific adventure are something else entirely. I don't think that ever happened to me.

 

[overgeeked]

This thread is not about aesthetics.

This thread is based on some weird stuff I see on Facebook, Reddit and even here: new players asking for specific strategy help with published 5E adventures. Not "help me build a cool character" or "how do I optimize versus devils" but literal, "how do I get past the cultists in Baldur's Gate?" or "Which Ten Towns adventures give the best loot?"

I think it's an related to power gaming & optimizing. Both treat the game as if it were a video game to be won. They both stem from MMO culture. Finding lists of best-in-slot items. Reading blogs about the best optimized / perfect builds. The attitude of anything less than the perfect build is stupid or a waste of time. Watching boss fight / raid videos for strategies. Grinding until you get the best loot. Etc.

It is crazy to me that people would ask questions like that for a tabletop RPG. First, it is inefficient because you have NO IDEA how the GM might change the adventure. But moreover it is basically cheating. You can't cheat in a single player CRPG because it is just you, but there are other people at your D&D table.

It's basically the same as players reading the Monster Manual and finding monster vulnerabilities...or any other form of metagaming.

Anyway, like I said, I have seen it popping up with an increasing frequency and I found it baffling.

Has anyone experienced this in real life? Have you ever had a player cheat at the table in this manner (reading the module beforehand or whatever)? Is it new or am I just noticing it now?

Yes, it's been around awhile. Yes, I've dealt with it in real life. Yes, I've had players cheat by reading the module ahead of time. I think it's old and you're just noticing it now.

 

[Reynard]

I think it's old and you're just noticing it now.

One more pleasant fiction about other humans social media has crushed for me...

 

[Oofta]

I don't use published odd but I've had people literally open the Monster Manual in the middle of the game and look up details on the monster I was running. Then proceed to tell everyone about the monster's actions and how many legendary actions they had left and so on.

It's incredibly annoying, and yes I politely informed the player to stop it. He was surprised that it mattered, even though I try to run descriptive combats.

So if this is happening to you? Talk to the player if it bothers you.

 

[Deset Gled]

I think it's old and you're just noticing it now.

As a point of reference, reading a published RPG adventure ahead of time to get an advantage is specifically discussed in the Hardy Boys D&D themed novel "Dungeon of Doom", originally published in 1989.

 

[Doug McCrae]

OD&D (1974) Vol I Men & Magic:

If you are a player purchasing the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS rules in order to improve your situation in an existing campaign, you will find that there is a great advantage in knowing what is herein. If your referee has made changes in the rules and/or tables, simply note them in pencil (for who knows when some flux of the cosmos will make things shift once again!), and keep the rules nearby as you play. A quick check of some rule or table may bring hidden treasure or save your game “life.”​

Dragon #10 (1977) Random Monsters, Paul Montgomery Crabaugh:

One of the problems with D&D is that the players always know too much. This is news? “You obtain surprise over three Clickclicks.”​

“Clickclicks? Oh, yeah, they’re in Supplement Three. Hand it to me. And where’s Greyhawk? It had a note about them.” A pause. “We​

shout out ‘November’.”​

“That’s right, the Clickclicks fall over dead.”​

Sound familiar?​

 

[loverdrive]

Well, I'd say, post-3E D&D is pretty videogamey. I'm starting to think that genre best suited for it is emulating diablo, lol.

But, anyway, honestly I personally enjoy playing modern adventure paths I've played/ran before much more than playing them fresh.

 

[Mallus]

I haven't encountered behavior like this. But I'm pretty confident the good people of Reddit didn't invent the idea of cheating their way through a D&D adventure. It's not like none of us ever bought the module the DM was running...

 

[Shiroiken]

I had a player in a different RPG who was absolutely horrible at this. The first was in an adventure I was greatly looking forward to running, and the players knew I had it. At first I didn't notice, but his character just happened to be trained in several obscure skills that made parts of it much easier to overcome (for example, one trap was avoided by dancing around it by rolling Reflexes/Dancing). I also realized after the fact that he'd made key decisions on which way to go, always choosing the easiest route. I was super irritated, but not as much as the next campaign, where he literally built his character to optimize the first adventure.