Jumping on a monster's back

[IcyCool]

I believe the Giantbane tactical feat in Complete Warrior has rules for something like this. I think it's called Climb Aboard.

 

[Corsair]

I always wondered why people think its a GOOD IDEA to get CLOSER to a giant scary monster, nor do I understand why anyone would want to encourage such foolhardy tactics, either as a player or DM. Me, gimme a bow and a Fly Speed, or maybe just a wand of fireballs.

 

[cincinnati reds]

I like the Climb vs. Grapple. I don't like the preference to rogues with the denied Dex bonus. You do not lose your Dex bonus in a grapple vs. creatures you grapple. And flanking with basically the ground makes no sense. The +1 for higher ground covers that aspect of it.

After reading this, you're right, I think I'd do away with the flanking bonus. I'd still keep the loss of Dex, though. I picture a barbarian with a handaxe in one hand and a hill giant's mullet in the other, viciously hacking away at the giant's neck... the giant can try to shake the barbarian off, but he sure can't dodge the blows of someone who's attached to him.

Just IMHO.

 

[cincinnati reds]

I always wondered why people think its a GOOD IDEA to get CLOSER to a giant scary monster, nor do I understand why anyone would want to encourage such foolhardy tactics, either as a player or DM. Me, gimme a bow and a Fly Speed, or maybe just a wand of fireballs.

It's all about looking good.

That's why Conan gets the ladies.

 

[Infiniti2000]

After reading this, you're right, I think I'd do away with the flanking bonus. I'd still keep the loss of Dex, though. I picture a barbarian with a handaxe in one hand and a hill giant's mullet in the other, viciously hacking away at the giant's neck... the giant can try to shake the barbarian off, but he sure can't dodge the blows of someone who's attached to him.

Just IMHO.

By the same interpretation, though, you'd need to deny the Dex bonus of anyone grappling (against the opponents in the grapple). That's really not a good idea, though. I'd point out that in a majority of these cases, the huge monster probably has no Dex bonus to lose, so the only effect this will have is giving the rogue-type PC a chance to use sneak attack. If that's the effect you want, okay, but your barbarian example leads me to believe otherwise.

 

[Quasqueton]

SRD (Stirge):

Attach (Ex): If a stirge hits with a touch attack, it uses its eight pincers to latch onto the opponent’s body. An attached stirge is effectively grappling its prey. The stirge loses its Dexterity bonus to AC and has an AC of 12, but holds on with great tenacity. Stirges have a +12 racial bonus on grapple checks (already figured into the Base Attack/Grapple entry above).

An attached stirge can be struck with a weapon or grappled itself. To remove an attached stirge through grappling, the opponent must achieve a pin against the stirge.

Can anything be worked from this?

Quasqueton

 

[kjenks]

I like an opposed Ride vs. Grapple.

(The following rules are entirely my invention.)

Treat it kind of like a grapple attack.

Entering the hostile mount's square provokes an AoO (like grapple step 1) unless you have the Mounted Combat feat. According to the (sadly untrustworthy) Rules of the Game articles, you need to be in the mount's square to mount up.

Mount as a move action, or make a Ride check DC 20 to mount as a free action (kind of like grapple step 2).

Now, since the mount is hostile, he gets an immediate grapple check, opposed by your Ride skill, to buck you out of the saddle (kind of like grapple step 3). If he wins, you're prone in an adjacent square. Use the usual Ride rules for falling from the saddle. (Choose a square randomly, or a mount with Int 3+ gets to choose which square you're in.) As usual with opposed rolls, ties go to the highest bonus, or reroll if same bonus and same total.

The rider must "pin" the hostile mount (rider's Ride check opposing the mount's grapple check) to get it under control. Every round, the rider must spend a move action and win an opposed Ride vs. grapple to keep the hostile mount under control. Failure means you're bucked from the saddle.

A hostile mount under a rider's control can only run, make move actions or make mounted charges. It won't attack anybody unless the rider also makes a Handle Animal check, per the Handle Animal rules.

So, under these rules, if you move in and mount up on a hostile mount, the mount gets a round of bucking (opposed grapple vs. your Ride skill) or biting (attack with natural weapon at -4, per grapple rules) to unseat you before you can get another attack action to get it under control.

That should be quite cinematic and lots of fun.

 

[Rkhet]

Here's a related question: My wizard shapechanges into a fly and lands on the back of a devastation spider. He's gonna stat-drain it to death. Logically, the spider should have no way of reaching his back with his limbs. But according to the rules...

So now, how would I model that?

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

So now, how would I model that?

The devastation spider decides to grapple you instead of making natural attacks.

Your grapple check is roughly ... -30?

He wins each of his iterative grapple checks, each time doing unarmed + Strength Bonus damage each time.

You die rapidly.

 

[Rkhet]

I know, I know, by the rules I would be dead before I even get there. It'd be kinda stupid, though: what is it gonna grapple with? The big hairs on its back? And how is it gonna grapple a fly that size?

On a barely related subject, devastation vermin are the most over-CRed creatures in the ELH. Even a pre-epic wizard can smack it up and down.