Kama + Improved Trip = Always "Free" Trip Attempt?

[vlysses]

As a monk with improved trip and a kama as weapon, can I use it to trip opponents without them "tripping back" in case I miss, just by dropping the weapon?

That would be pretty powerful, as one could always use it to for "free" trip attempts, no?

Although not quite as powerful and effective, but it would be a nice fix if taking 2 skills to get Prone Attack feat seemed to expensive... do you agree?

Thanks. V

 

[Shin Okada]

From SRD,

IMPROVED TRIP [GENERAL]
Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise.
Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when you attempt to trip an opponent while you are unarmed. You also gain a +4 bonus on your Strength check to trip your opponent.
If you trip an opponent in melee combat, you immediately get a melee attack against that opponent as if you hadn’t used your attack for the trip attempt.
Normal: Without this feat, you provoke an attack of opportunity when you attempt to trip an opponent while you are unarmed.
Special: At 6th level, a monk may select Improved Trip as a bonus feat, even if she does not have the prerequisites.
A fighter may select Improved Trip as one of his fighter bonus feats.

Unlike Improved Disarm, Improved Trip does not remove counter tripping from your opponent.

And having this feat or not, if you are using a Kama (or other weapon which can be usable for tripping) and lost in the opposed strength check, you can choose to drop your weapon if you fear counter-tripping from your opponent. But that is by no mean a "free trip" attempt. You failed in tripping opponent and lost a weapon.

 

[Runestar]

Which is why every monk carries a guisarme around, regardless of whether he is proficient or not.

 

[moritheil]

Welcome to the boards!

As a monk with improved trip and a kama as weapon, can I use it to trip opponents without them "tripping back" in case I miss, just by dropping the weapon?

That would be pretty powerful, as one could always use it to for "free" trip attempts, no?

Although not quite as powerful and effective, but it would be a nice fix if taking 2 skills to get Prone Attack feat seemed to expensive... do you agree?

Thanks. V

I'm not really sure what "pretty powerful" is supposed to be relative to. Better than regular trip? Certainly. More powerful than, say, the Sudden Maximize feat? Probably not.

What are you asking about Prone Attack? You think it should be two feats?

 

[vlysses]

thank you all, esp. the guisarme tip... ;-)

what i meant re prone attack is that in order to get it, even as a monk, i have to take lightning reflexes first, then prone attack, thus using up 2 feats in order to minimise the potential negative consequences of a failed trip attempt. with a guisarme or kama, i can make the trip attempt practically "for free" as it ultimately does not matter much if i drop the weapon, given unarmed fighting style...

ok, i may not be able to repeat the trip attempt without the risk of falling flat on my face, but i also have 2 feat slots that i can use otherwise...

given the one handed mature of the kama, i think i would prefer it over the guisarme, as i can then follow through with the flurry of blows, once the opponent is on the floor.

what do you say, is it worthwhile to use up the 2 feats to get prone attack, given the above?

thanks, V

 

[moritheil]

what do you say, is it worthwhile to use up the 2 feats to get prone attack, given the above?

I wouldn't, unless you have really bad ref saves for some reason (and thus Lighting Reflexes becomes useful to you.)

Bear in mind that there are going to be things you can't trip - huge quadrupedal monsters, golems, etc. They just have too much in the way of strength and size bonuses. So while trip can be awesome against human-sized opponents, I'm not sure I'd want to spend all your feats on trip-related things.

 

[vlysses]

thanks moritheil, for confirming what i have suspected...

on the issue of reach weapons, i have started a new thread above - i would much appreciate it if you had any insight.

thanks, V