Knight Phantom from Five Nations

[jasin]

Excerpt at the WotC site.

Is it just me, or is this a bit over the top?

It's like a spellsword who doesn't get the bonus feat at 1st, but gets a HD upgrade to d8, the ability to cast in light armour, the ability to summon a phantom steed a number of times/day equal to class level, blur for a number of rounds equal to class level, a brilliant energy weapon for a number of rounds equal to class level...

... for the additional cost of having taken Still Spell, 4 ranks in ride, and phantom steed as one of his spells known.

I love the concept, because it's like an eldritch knight with flavour, and good flavour, since phantom steed is very cool and very underused.

But compared to eldritch knight as a baseline, this just seems too much.

BTW, if someone has Five Nations (is it even out yet...?), is there some way in there to get proficiency with all martial weapons without taking a martial class (like Militia from PGtF)? An NPC is a wizard 6/knight phantom 6, and the knight phantom requires proficiency with all martial weapons...

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Eberron Setting

It is a powerful class, but when considering the balance, remember that the 5 Nations is an Eberron specific book. In that setting, the high level NPC's cap out at 14th to 15th.
A 10th level Phantom Knight would be one of the most powerful characters in the world.

And to clarify, its per day usage is 1 round per level of Phantom Knight, so the Brilliant Weapon ability is usable for 10 rounds a day.

 

[jasin]

It is a powerful class, but when considering the balance, remember that the 5 Nations is an Eberron specific book. In that setting, the high level NPC's cap out at 14th to 15th.
A 10th level Phantom Knight would be one of the most powerful characters in the world.

What does that have to do with anything?

It's still supposed to be just as powerful as any other 14th or 15th level character.

And to clarify, its per day usage is 1 round per level of Phantom Knight, so the Brilliant Weapon ability is usable for 10 rounds a day.

Right.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

It has to do with the fact that you wont see epic, multi-PrC insane builds with this class.. unless the DM allows it into another setting or expands on the setting as written.

Yes, it does need to be balanced against other classes normally, I just wanted to point out that comparisons based on the 'get this from here, and 5 levels of that there...' may not be the best.

I think the relatively limited durations on the abilities make it on the same scale as a melee focused Cleric.
{I am more knowledgeable of base class alterations than splat-book PrC's}

JMHO. Perhaps one of the other PrC knowledgable folks here can speak better to your point.

 

[Nightfall]

That..and most of Eberron rarely thinks of power builds.

 

[Wrathamon]

you lose a feat and if the DM enforces the RP restrictions it may balance itself out with the EK because it is campaign focused more.

That and maybe the flavour isnt for everyone like the add your own flavor EK.

 

[Nightfall]

Eh I just liked the stuff on Aundair. It's one of my favorite Eberron Kingdoms.

 

[jasin]

Yes, it does need to be balanced against other classes normally, I just wanted to point out that comparisons based on the 'get this from here, and 5 levels of that there...' may not be the best.

But I'm not basing my comparisons on some wacky multi-PrC cherry-picking uberbuild from the WotC Character Optimization boards.

I'm comparing Ftr1/Wiz5/knight phantom to Ftr1/Wiz5/eldritch knight (which is your generic core books Ftr/Wiz PrC, so it makes sense to compare other Ftr/Wiz types against it), and the knight phantom undeniably better. Something is at fault: either the knight phantom is overpowered, or the eldritch knight is weak (which is what quite a few peole one RPGnet thought).

 

[demiurge1138]

Well, eldritch knight is pretty weak. But knight phantom is pretty powerful, too. I'd consider lowering the hit die to d6, but that's about it.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure the class breakdown on the sample NPC was a mistake.

Demiurge out.

 

[Nightfall]

Since I didn't read much further into it, demi, care to elaborate on how its broken/wrong? (The sample NPC mind you not the class)