Leadership- how to?

[SidusLupus]

Amongst my group of friends, none of us has really ever taken the Leadership feat.

Last night, one of my players deceided he'd like to go with that route. There's only three of them, so I'm okay with them having access to leadership. The thing is, I've never really seen leadership in action, and I had a few questions on it.

As far as I understand it, the player chooses what kind of cohort they want, i.e. the class. Then I get to go design it appropriately for him. The cohort has to be 2 levels lower than the leader, at all times.

Then the question becomes, who runs him? Obviously the cohort is an npc. The way the DMG says it, it sounds like he's controlled by the leader. The thing is then, that's not really an npc but a second pc. So then, does the leader controll the cohort in combat, and for skills manipulation, but for Rping that's my job? Or do I just control everything as best as I can. Help and tips would be appreciated.

Also, the followers. As I peg it right now, he's not got a high enough leadership score to have followers. When he gains followers how does one handle that? Stat them all out? What do you do with them? First level npc classes are pretty fragile, you can't just take them dungeon crawling with you. Also, is leadership still worth having if you just can't ever have followers?

I must amend what I said earlier. I myself actually did take leadership once but I never got to use the cohort and the followers were just money leeches. I felt somewhat screwed in taking leadership, and I come asking these things because I dont want the player to feel he wasted the feat because I ran it wrong.

Help me ENworld, you're my only hope!

 

[carnivore]

Hey there Sid.

I use leadership extensively in my campaign, here is how I use it (as a DM and as a player):
The player controls the actions of the cohort completely - like it was a second character to play. The DM has some input on the cohort's creation but lets the player do the build.

Followers are very fragile. I have seen them used thusly:
They run the "homebase" (ie: ship, guildhouse, keep, lighthouse or whatever the PCs use as an HQ). This gives control over the HQ to the PCs (well... a tad more than usual) fore the PC with leadership also runs followers completely. In my games, I have left control of the building of followers to players but they tend to get overwhlemed sometimes in building 15x war1, 3x exp2, and 1x exp3. I instead do those mass builds for them - followers are relatively weak so it's all about personality with them.

How this all works out in my experience is pretty good. When players get all crazy and start throwing the cohort and followers in front of them the followers start getting killed as does the cohort... watch that leadership score! Let's say 5 followers get killed due to the irresposibility of the player, the leadership score will drop (due to the player "causing the death of other followers") a point or two (DMG pg. 106) as does the cohort level maybe (loss of score due to "cruelty" and/or failure). This is when the old cohort leaves and a new one may show up (at lower level of course).

Things tend to balance out if it is a long-term campaign.

Hope this is useful.

 

[eris404]

One thing we've been considering in our group: familiars, animal companions and followers are played by other players. For example:

Player A has a familiar
Player B has an animal companion
Player C has a follower

Player A plays player B's companion
Player B plays player C's follower
Player C plays player A's familiar

That way, the followers have a definite personality and aren't just extensions of the PC. This also works well if the group gets split up for some reason and gives the players whose characters aren't present something to do.

 

[Arkhandus]

The DM dictates how followers and cohorts will work. It is purposely left up to the DM to figure out how he wants to run Leadership in his or her game. You decide who picks the cohort/followers, and you decide who picks the classes and races of these minions, and you decide who will run the minions in RP and combat (or perhaps separate those duties).

As written, though, the DM is supposed to determine what the cohort is, at least, and the PC only gets a little input as to what kind of cohort he or she wants to attract. The PC can say they want a human sorcerer cohort, for instance, but the DM is the one who actually decides what the cohort will be; the PC may have to turn away several fighter, cleric, bard, barbarian, elf, halfling, and gnome cohort-wannabees before a human sorcerer approaches him or her some months later, to see about getting to travel with the hero and share in his or her heroics.

Of course, the DM can choose to just leave the cohort choosing and design entirely up to the player, but generally the DM is encouraged to exercise at least some control over the process.

IMHO, the DM should choose and design the cohorts and followers because they really are NPCs, even though he or she may end up giving control of them to the players. The DM should at least make sure that the player doesn't just use his cohort as a selfless, fanatical buddy of the PC, always doing everything he's told to no matter how stupid or suicidal (unless, of course, the DM is going to make the cohort's fanatical behavior come off as extremely creepy or wierd, or does something to make the cohort's behavior call the PC's morality into question with the way he sends the unusually fanatical cohort into stuff; getting the hairy eye of Paladins or something to gaze warily over the PC).

Myself, I've only seen the Leadership feat used once in a game I've run, when the PC Courtier acquired a Samurai cohort to serve as his yojimbo. I designed and ran the cohort, but he basically just did as the PC Courtier told him to do. The PC would give a command, and the loyal yojimbo would comply. If the Courtier fell unconscious from an arrow that got past the yojimbo's body-as-meat-shield, the yojimbo took the initiative and retrieved a healing potion from the Courtier's gear and administered it to the fallen leader, even if it left himself open to being shot full of arrows that round, collapsing next to the revived Courtier. Who spent his own turn reviving the yojimbo with a potion, who then went back to fighting for his leader's life. It wasn't a great arrangement, but it was all I could come up with at the time; in hindsight I would've been better off letting the player control his cohort during battle, to save myself the trouble and give him something more to do.

I'd suggest you design the minions but take the gist of the PC's suggestions to heart; if the PC wants a certain kind of cohort, he or she should acquire such a cohort eventually if he or she keeps looking, and in the meantime he or she might acquire a similar cohort to serve until then. In your small group, I'd let the player control his minions for the most part, but you should exercise some control over them as well. The player might determine some of the minions' personality qualities or something, but the DM should determine the majority of that stuff and make sure that the minions are run accurately. Cohorts and followers won't blindly throw themselves into a suicidal situation, unless their leader is truly awe-inspiring or something; most PCs aren't paragons of virtue, honor, and inspiration. Followers are less likely than cohorts to risk themselves so terribly. You should probably NPC some of the minions for roleplaying purposes at the very least.

A good use for followers in combat is to have them stay out of harm's way, but carry some of the group's healing potions and such, then run a potion out to an ally when needed. It should probably be a full-round action to administer a potion to someone who's not spending their own actions to drink it; sorta like administering it to an unconscious ally, except that the ally is just moving about to dodge and such, so the follower has to take more time to administer sips and gulps of the potion. That's how I ran it when the PC Courtier and his Samurai cohort were falling unconscious, as more PCs started falling unconscious too, so the heimin followers began running out to administer potions to their masters, reviving them to continue the fight and defeat the large group of bandits that had ambushed them. When needed, the followers can even just use the Heal skill to try and stabilize an ally or whatnot.

Followers aren't really necessary, and they can be turned away if the PC desires. They aren't much use in combat and aren't meant to be; they can help in an assault or a defense sometimes, but they're most likely to be serving their leader as porters, repairmen, laborers, craftsmen, hunters, supply-gatherers, errand-boys, messengers, couriers, scouts, spies, informants, intermediaries, brokers, and so on. Followers are more likely than cohorts and NPCs to work behind the scenes, out of immediate attention, supporting their leader from the background by handling stuff that the leader is too busy or dignified to take on himself; a follower might spy and steal and investigate for his or her leader without that leader even knowing about it. They just want to help, or to be associated with someone like their leader. Followers will probably run the leader's household, headquarters, business ventures, and so on and so forth. They might help transport treasure and supplies. They might follow from a safe distance while bringing gear for digging projects, earthworks, and the like.

 

[Tonguez]

I let PCs create their own cohorts (I also let them create their NPC families and even NPC allies (equal level) and one patrons (higher level = Lv + cha)).
PCs have a degree of Influence over their cohorts and NPC allies and can use that influence to suggest a particular course of action which I as DM then decide to resolve or not. A cohort can refuse to do what the PC suggests/requests/commands

followers I treat as 'workers' (which some of my players call 'labour points') they tend to be left at the homebase and given a job to do (ie the labour points are spent). I personally wont allow followers to go dungeon crawling but sometimes I will have the homebase threatened by marauding orcs or a hungry griffon...

 

[Storm Raven]

Here is how I handle it.

Cohorts are made like PCs, using the 4d6, drop the lowest method, and can be any race or class. The player decides what race and class and attributes he wants his cohort to have, subject to my approval (in general, particularly outlandish combinations will be rejected). The cohort arrives with gear appropriate to an NPC of its level. The cohort is an NPC under the player's control, but I reserve the right to take control of the cohort at any time, for any reason.

Followers are made using 3d6 rolls, and can be human or the PCs race. Followers can be any NPC class, except Aristocrats, and Adepts have to specially approved. Followers arrive with gear approprate to an NPC of its level. Followers do not gain experience, but when the PC's leadership score rises to a point where he would be eligible for a higher level follower, one of his current followers can gain a level, or he can elect to recruit an entirely new higher level NPC. Followers are generally run by me, although in certain circumstances they could be run by the player. In general, followers are a support network, and not an adventuring aide, for example a PC who owned a ship could have his followers crew the ship, but they would not be willing to assault the evil temple of doom.

Neither followers nor cohorts will obey obviously suicidal orders, although they are willing to take risks on the PCs behalf if the risks seem reasonable for characters of their level.

 

[interwyrm]

In combat, followers are useful as archers. Out of combat... I dunno, experts as fletchers, alchemists, etc. so that you can have a steady supply of tanglefoot bags and arrows? I really like the idea of a bard/marshal/warchanter who can increase the attack and damage of all of those arrows.