Pathfinder 1E Leif's Whirtlestaff's Wizards' Academy Reprise, [Pfdr] [OOC 03]

[Leif]

Animate Dead is not ordinarily a Bard spell. But, for the prestige class under discussion here, I would certainly think that an argument could well be made for adding that one to the Bard list, and, presumably as a 4th level spell.

 

[Scott DeWar]

also adding the spell from the spell compendium: summon monster I and II and so on would be a good add to that bard lsist too, wouldn't it?

 

[Leif]

Could be, indeed. I wonder why they didn't put more conjuration/summoning spells on the Bard list to begin with? Summoning seems to be something readily accomplished by music.

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

Dirge Singer:

1. Any Neutral Alignment
2. Ability to Turn/Rebuke Undead or ability to Summon/Control undead via spells
3. Perform (Sing): 8 Ranks

There would likely be others as well (possibly the ability to cast 3rd level spells?), but these fall in line with the stuff you've mentioned specifically.

This way you avoid requiring levels in specific classes (which the guidelines say to stay away from), but there are still prereqs that insure certain classes are more likely candidates.

For example, Perform's not a class skill for many of the classes so if you're not a bard (or something like it) you're gonna have to be really high level to get 8 ranks. Even a Bard has to be 5th level to get those ranks.

A Cleric 01/Bard 05 could qualify under these prereqs (if you didn't add others, such as the ability to cast a minimum level spell). Other classes, such as Paladin, could still qualify but would have to be much higher level.

Also, it seem like rather than adding Animate Dead to the Bard list, instead you'd be making a list specific to the Dirge Singer PrC, and Animate Dead would be on that list, right? 'Cause if you add it to the Bard list you're not making a PrC, you're modifying a base class.

 

[Leif]

Dirge Singer:

1. Any Neutral Alignment
2. Ability to Turn/Rebuke Undead or ability to Summon/Control undead via spells
3. Perform (Sing): 8 Ranks

There would likely be others as well (possibly the ability to cast 3rd level spells?), but these fall in line with the stuff you've mentioned specifically.

This way you avoid requiring levels in specific classes (which the guidelines say to stay away from), but there are still prereqs that insure certain classes are more likely candidates.

For example, Perform's not a class skill for many of the classes so if you're not a bard (or something like it) you're gonna have to be really high level to get 8 ranks. Even a Bard has to be 5th level to get those ranks.

A Cleric 01/Bard 05 could qualify under these prereqs (if you didn't add others, such as the ability to cast a minimum level spell). Other classes, such as Paladin, could still qualify but would have to be much higher level.

Also, it seem like rather than adding Animate Dead to the Bard list, instead you'd be making a list specific to the Dirge Singer PrC, and Animate Dead would be on that list, right? 'Cause if you add it to the Bard list you're not making a PrC, you're modifying a base class.

Yes, you're right about all of this. I nominate Mowgli to be in charge of designing PrC's for this game, can I get someone to second this nomination?

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

Didn't mean to butt in . . . well I did, in terms of adding some thoughts, but not in terms of taking over! Carry on, gentlemen!

 

[Leif]

Didn't mean to butt in . . . well I did, in terms of adding some thoughts, but not in terms of taking over! Carry on, gentlemen!

Too bad! You've already opened your mouth, and it's quite clear that you know more about this subject than I do. See, Scotley probably knows lots about it, too, but he had the good sense to keep quiet. You, however, have been CONSCRIPTED! On the good side, it's not like there's just a great deal of demand for this stuff.

 

[Scott DeWar]

I would recommend to change the perform ranks to 6 or 7 and making spell casting of 2nd level spells.

the ability to turn/rebuke undead would be a class feature of the dirge singer given at level 1.

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

I would recommend to change the perform ranks to 6 or 7 and making spell casting of 2nd level spells.

the ability to turn/rebuke undead would be a class feature of the dirge singer given at level 1.

Oh, right - 'cause any class that has access to turn/rebuke can do it by the time they can cast 2nd level spells anyway. Dirge Singer levels would stack with levels of other classes that can turn/rebuke for purposes of that ability, right?

Up to you how easy/hard you make it to qualify - it's your PrC!

 

[Scotley]

Perhaps the Dirge Singer would give up some of the usual benefits of bardic music in favor of using perform to Summon Undead as the spells of the same name?