Let's Forget the Forgotten Realms

[Henry]

[MENTION=17850]Russ[/MENTION]:

You are no longer my Facebook Friend.




That said, If Greyhawk were the "default" setting again, it wouldn't hurt me because i know it and like it just as well. I really didn't have much of an appreciation for the Realms until a really good DM about eleven years ago kindled a love of the setting in me. Though I don't game with him any more, he gave me a different perspective on it, and the big deal with the Realms is BECAUSE everything is detailed out in volumed, because I could tell you in detail what a day in the life of an inhabitant could be, is the appeal. Contrast this to Golarion or Greyhawk where the broad strokes are filled in, but it's up to you to fill in all sorts of minor detail, from the name of a particular inn & tavern, to what food and drink it serves, to why there is a puddle of flesh-morphed and petrified wizards half-phased into the ceiling, and how they got there.

What the spellplague tried to do was to turn the Realms into Greyhawk, post-Greyhawk Wars, essentially, where the safe zones were few, and the triumph of good was in doubt EVERYWHERE, no "safe zones". Problem is, the Realms doesn't work that way, and there's room for a second type of campaign setting.

 

[cildarith]

Bah. If 5E is to be a mish-mash of old rules, the least WotC can do is provide us with a new setting.

 

[scruffygrognard]

I absolutely agree with Morris on this... and think I may have a man-crush on him now.

Greyhawk or Forgotten Realms: There can be only one!

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

Oh, there those two go again, always arguing about whether it is better to know everything or know only what your character would know.

Hey! I'm here too! You and me are the same! I have bouts of multiple personality while posting too!

Yup, you get it. If I like a setting, I'll devour everything I can for it and, in the process, I might ruin it for myself. In the meantime, I expect the world to function as I know it to, and woe be to he who changes my fake-reality.

Adding something to the unknown is good and easy to accept. Removing or changing something known causes people to recoil. It's the same reason why having a simple core that you add complexity to is more acceptable than having a complex core with removable pieces.

This isn't to say that Greyhawk is objectively superior to Forgotten Realms in a vacuum, but that the former would be a more useful default setting.

That said, they might be planning to do with the Forgotten Realms what Paizo is doing with Golarion, and that could be a very smart move. I admit that the Pathfinder model is working well and that I'm tempted to subscribe to the setting content.

 

[Le Noir Faineant]

I think Russ is right, not so much because of Greyhawk (though I am still a die-hard Hawker) vs FR, but because of customer accessibility:

As a gamer in my late 20s, I have no time to make research for a D&D campaign my second job, not even for a week, or so. Thus, settings that come with lots of baggage are not working for me.

One book, or two, and I need to have a coherent overview of that setting that enables me to run satisfying games for people new to it, as well as for experienced veterans. Now, try that with the novel-driven settings FR, or Dragonlance: Nearly impossible.

So, the core of D&D should remain a setting that doesn't require regular customer attention to work - and that's what Greyhawk really is.

Now, "new", 4e Realms might still do the trick, but then again, 250 novels in the back is gargantuan. Wizbro should either go back to well-appreciated simplicity, or come up with something completely new.

 

[GM Dave]

The easiest approach for WotC would be to do a two-prong approach.

1> Prong one is their announced support of FR. That requires 1 world book which they could write 90% of it now if they choose to just do a setting over view book. Any 'mechanics' parts can not be written but they can lay out what they feel will need to be part of that. They could even do an 'update' book on a narrow section of the world.

Freelance writers and Ezine Dragon writers that live and breath FR will fill in the rest with fan content.

2> Prong two is a series of articles and a setting built for the 'new' GM to DnD 5e or the person that is returning and wants something 'fresh'. I'd put a few overall people in charge of setting up the overall concept of the world and major motions that will determine the feel.

Use this information to put together some writer packages for the writers to get a chance to review and develop ideas with agents for proposals. Best ideas get green lit for the initial set of books for the new setting.

Roll out of the new setting starts in roughly thirteen months in Dragon Ezine with the announcement of the column of discussing world development on the 'fictional' new world and setting. It is a Ezine centred development for the first year with plans to gather the material into a full setting book at the end of the year.

Weekly articles can cover items like towns, religion, countries, politics, and places to adventure. This gives a weekly build on the new setting but doesn't commit to the actual role-out and gives time to modify items that lack ressonance.

The new books should start to roll out for the new setting three to four months after GenCon release of 5e. The aim here is that people will have had time to absorb the new information, wind down old campaigns and be willing to explore things in the Oct to Dec time frame (Christmas novel buying peaks). People will have seen the articles for three months in Dragon Ezine and will be curious what stories are going to get written for the new world.

Have demand precede supply.

By May of 2014 WotC should be able to make a full commitment to the new setting or be looking at supporting something else.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

Dark Sun worked out well being rebooted back to nearly the same timeline as the original boxed set.

As much as I love all era of Greyhawk, I'm an even bigger fan of the post-Wars Greyhawk than the original release, I believe that Greyhawk could be rebooted like Dark Sun was for 4e back to the original release timeline very successfully. Especially if Greyhawk serves mostly as a proper name generator and as a framework to place a thin veneer of a story around generic adventures.

 

[Warunsun]

...I believe that Greyhawk could be rebooted like Dark Sun was for 4e back to the original release timeline very successfully.

I had considered this idea as well. Just think if they reboot Greyhawk for 5E and also re-release new versions of some of the classic Hawk adventure modules. I don't mean more return-to scenarios but stuff like a fully revised and possibly expanded Temple of Elemental Evil super module. That would be way fun if it was written nicely. I think we could all enjoy replaying it with a few new interesting turns or extra encounters with up-to-date game rules.

I did enjoy running the 3E Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil and my players also enjoyed it. Monte Cook authored that one and he is back on staff. When I ran it I converted some of the 1E adventures tied into the RTTTOEE and ran them in the same campaign. It was fun. WotC could take that background work from RTTTOEE and actually work it into the original scenario for a fresh and classic trip into nostalgic land.

I wonder if this new "Elminster's Forgotten Realms" is a reboot of the pre-spell-plague era of Forgotten Realms. It could also be a reprint anthology of any number of Dragon Magazine articles he has written.

 

[Zaukrie]

the more I think about it, the more I want a new setting. That way we don't have any baggage about the setting. I'm already tired of reading about all the baggage that everyone feels (for some reason that i don't understand) they need to carry with every existing setting.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

I think any new setting will suffer from design-by-committee mediocrity.