Let's Talk About Core Game Mechanics

[Barner Cobblewood]

The d20 has the advantage of fairly regular "crits." That's just generally makes the game more exciting.

I agree, but I think 10% of the rolls (5% at each end) is just too much, and detracts from / discourages players from advancing their PC's level, skills etc. Then again, I like so-called "lower-level" games.

EDIT because grammr

 

[Bill Zebub]

I meant compared to 3d6.

Sure, but even then you could define it a whole bunch of ways other than "max possible result". I haven't done the math on this, but it could be "on a success, if 2 of the dice are the same you do double damage; if all 3 are the same you do quadruple damage".

So let's do the math....

Let's say your TN is 14 (with no modifiers). That gives you about a ~10% chance to get double damage, and an additional ~1% to get quadruple damage.

 

[Bill Zebub]

EDIT because grammr

I am a programer
I am a programmar
I am a programor
$%&@....I write code.

 

[Reynard]

I agree, but I think 10% of the rolls (5% at each end) is just too much, and detracts from / discourages players from advancing their PC's level, skills etc. Then again, I like so-called "lower-level" games.

EDIT because grammr

That's interesting. How have you seen that manifest?

 

[Reynard]

Sure, but even then you could define it a whole bunch of ways other than "max possible result". I haven't done the math on this, but it could be "on a success, if 2 of the dice are the same you do double damage; if all 3 are the same you do quadruple damage".

So let's do the math....

Let's say your TN is 14 (with no modifiers). That gives you about a ~10% chance to get double damage, and an additional ~1% to get quadruple damage.

Sure. Again, I was responding to a specific comment.

The Marvel game uses a 3d6 pool, but only one (the marvel die) determines a "crit". The result there is a very high chance of a fantastic result, which feels right for a supers game.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Sure. Again, I was responding to a specific comment.

The Marvel game uses a 3d6 pool, but only one (the marvel die) determines a "crit". The result there is a very high chance of a fantastic result, which feels right for a supers game.

Ahhh....got it. I was taking it as a more general comment. /salute

 

[JohnSnow]

The d20 has the advantage of fairly regular "crits." That's just generally makes the game more exciting.

Worth noting that AGE sort of hacks 3d6 to have a system for more common "crits" by creative use of both doubles and degrees of success based on the Stunt Die.

The problem I've noticed with dice pool systems is that the value of bonuses is non-intuitive and figuring it out is non-trivial math. That can be a feature or a bug, depending on what you're after.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Worth noting that AGE sort of hacks 3d6 to have a system for more common "crits" by creative use of both doubles and degrees of success based on the Stunt Die.

The problem I've noticed with dice pool systems is that the value of bonuses is non-intuitive and figuring it out is non-trivial math. That can be a feature or a bug, depending on what you're after.

Yeah, in my mind it's a feature. I want players to have a sense of how hard something is, but I also want decisions to be difficult (if they are not difficult then it's not really a decision).

 

[JohnSnow]

Sure, but even then you could define it a whole bunch of ways other than "max possible result". I haven't done the math on this, but it could be "on a success, if 2 of the dice are the same you do double damage; if all 3 are the same you do quadruple damage".

So let's do the math....

Let's say your TN is 14 (with no modifiers). That gives you about a ~10% chance to get double damage, and an additional ~1% to get quadruple damage.

AGE (sort of) does exactly this, granting a number of Stunt Points (SP) for rolling doubles. You get the number of SP showing on the Stunt Die, which also determines degree of success.

SP must be spent immediately, and there's a whole table of stunts you can pull off, but two of them are "Mighty Blow" (2 SP) and "Lethal Blow" (4 SP). But because the other stunt options give you a whole range of cool naughty word (reposition you or your target, knock someone prone, disarm, boost your defense, take an extra attack, set up a second attack, etc.), I doubt people would always just opt for "more damage."

I like this part of the AGE system in concept, and although I hate tables, I think I could memorize this one. However, I've never been able to get my group to play it.

As an aside, the chance of doubles of any kind is much higher than you think, especially once you start factoring in bonuses to the check. In AGE, those bonuses can easily hit +6, even at low levels. That monkeys with the percentages a LOT.

 

[Bill Zebub]

As an aside, the chance of doubles of any kind is much higher than you think,

Um....ok. What do you think the odds are of rolling doubles (but not triples) if you need 14+? I think there are exactly 21 different ways, out of 216 (6^3) total ways to roll 3 dice:

6 6 2
6 2 6
2 6 6
6 6 3
6 3 6
3 6 6
6 6 4
6 4 6
4 6 6
6 6 5
6 5 6
5 6 6
5 5 4
5 4 5
4 5 5
5 5 6
5 6 5
6 5 5
4 4 6
4 6 4
6 4 4

EDIT: Note that I'm calculating the the chance to crit equivalent to saying that in D&D you have a 5% chance to crit. That is, not your chance to crit if you hit, but your chance to crit before you even roll the dice. The chance to crit assuming you hit is much higher.