Locating a Druid using Natural Spell

[kigmatzomat]

The "magic sparklies" or dark presence has its own drawbacks when you have the silent/invis casters. If you want something the shadowrun "totem mask" where the caster's appearance changes that would work.

I'm still bashing my head against the concept that everyone recognizes spellcasting. The only rules presented involve AoOs (which is due to distraction that can be countered by a Concentration Check) and counterspelling, which requires the counterspeller to *be* a spellcaster, involves a held action, specifies the counterspellee prior to their casting, and has a Spellcraft check.

I think part of the problem is the inherent function of 3e that you can see everything that goes on in a round unless there's obscurement. I have a serious logical disconnect that if there are 30 people standing in a circle all doing something different that a single individual in the middle is aware of all the actions. The RAW say that's the way it is but it feels very deeply wrong.

I might send something to WotC CS to see what they say about the general issue of being aware of everything in range as well as the "does every peasant recognize spellcasting" factor (and then do the opposite).

 

[TheEvil]

I feel the need to reiterate what someone said many posts back:
DRUIDS CANNOT BECOME DIMINUTIVE!
Thanks for bearing with me.

That said, I think Lord Pendragon says it best: A human casting a spell doesn't sound like a human talking (remembering Gandolf and Sauroman from LoTR), so why would a animal casing sound like an animal's normal sounds. Spell casting has a certain rythme and tone to them that is different from talking, so one can resonably assume that the animal's sounds will likewise sound different. Yes, audiblity is an issue, but one I am willing to set aside in the name of not making Natural Spell even more over powered then it is now.

I might send something to WotC CS to see what they say about the general issue of being aware of everything in range as well as the "does every peasant recognize spellcasting" factor (and then do the opposite).

I nice idea, but you can't depend on CS giving you answer that is readily coverted to an opposite.

 

[smetzger]

kigmatzomat - here is some more evidence. Spellcraft allows one to identify a spell being cast. However, there is no mention of modifiers to identify a non-humanoid casting a spell. Therefore, it is no more difficult to identify a spell being cast by a squirrel then it is to identify a spell being cast by a human. Therefore, use the same rules to notice a squirrel casting a spell and a human casting a spell.

I believe the reasons for auto-recognizing a spellcasting stems from simplicity and balance. It has very little to do with logical anatomy limitations. Its a game some shortcuts/simplifying is done.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Except for where I pointed you to the section on Counterspelling.

I'm a tad bit late in this discussion, but it is a very interesting read so far...just wanted to point out that all you actually gave evidence for is that spellcasters are able to automatically recognize somebody casting a spell, and then being allowed a counterspelling via Spellcraft.

For everybody else, it's up to the DM to describe the "weird-looking guy in wide robes, brimming with talismans, twisting his fingers into strange positions while going through an alien-sounding singsong, flinging a tiny ball of yellow and grey in your direction".

Or, for the feat in question, the "kangaroo hopping in one place, with it's paws going through some strange movements, chittering and growling in a weird melody while fixating you with it's eyes".

 

[Kalendraf]

The "magic sparklies" or dark presence has its own drawbacks when you have the silent/invis casters.

I was working under the assumption that invisibility would mask the sparkles. In addition, hiding would allow the caster to a method of obscuring them. In other words, the "Sparkly Magic" would have only one primary effect - allowing untrained eyes to recognize spellcasting. Of course it adds some visual flare & flavor too, but that's not a rules issue.

Unless an exact rule can be found that specifically states everyone & everything recognizes casting, I think using a houserule like sparkly magic is probably the simplest way to handle it. Everything still works the same, and it presents an explanation as to why casting magic is recognizable.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

I feel the need to reiterate what someone said many posts back:
DRUIDS CANNOT BECOME DIMINUTIVE!
Thanks for bearing with me.

Sure they can. Reduce Animal, right?

And the description for Natural Spell says that you substitute the animal form's sounds and gestures for those normally required to cast the spell. It doesn't say the form gains any additional vocal abilities. I thought Gandalf's voice sounded quite a bit like a human speaking when he cast Dispel Evil on Theoden or Knock on the Mines of Moria.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I thought Gandalf's voice sounded quite a bit like a human speaking when he cast Dispel Evil on Theoden or Knock on the Mines of Moria.

Too bad Gandalf wasn't a D&D character. It'd make this point really compelling.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

Too bad Gandalf wasn't a D&D character. It'd make this point really compelling.

*sigh* I should have been clearer. I was referring to an earlier post:

A human casting a spell doesn't sound like a human talking (remembering Gandolf and Sauroman from LoTR),