Logic behind sales of "Expedition to Castle Greyhawk"?

[delericho]

If the "medieval fantasy" D&D audience is not to be split between FR and GH, I agree with this statement 110%. So long as FR is supported, there is not room in the marketplace IMO for another broad, sweeping "medieval fantasy" D&D setting. While GH and FR are fundamentally different in detail, in very broad outline they are much the same in terms of how they approach the "medieval fantasy" genre of D&D. If FR did not exist, GH could be published "as is" and sell gangbusters, I'm convinced. But as FR occupies the mainline "medieval fantasy" field at the moment, it seems GH must evolve into something that FR is definably not before Wotc will have an interest in publishing both settings or seeing GH published by a third party under license.

One thing that occurs is that there might be room for a 'bare bones' type of setting. One of the things that really turns me off on the FR is that there's just so much of it. A setting that was just one book, with the implicit "do what you want with it" might well be something I would be interested in.

That said, I don't know that Greyhawk, with 35-odd years of accumulated history, could ever be that setting either...

 

[delericho]

Ok well I guess coming on here and trying to be honest is a waste of time. Next time I post about topics of internal meetings I'll be sure to lie since telling the truth seems to be getting nowhere.

I hope you don't think that. I've been very glad of the renewed Wizards presence here of late. It was just a shame that it took the end of Dragon and Dungeon to bring it about.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

One thing that occurs is that there might be room for a 'bare bones' type of setting. One of the things that really turns me off on the FR is that there's just so much of it. A setting that was just one book, with the implicit "do what you want with it" might well be something I would be interested in.

That said, I don't know that Greyhawk, with 35-odd years of accumulated history, could ever be that setting either...

*cough* Thunder Rift *cough*

 

[mhacdebhandia]

Yeah, there're more places that're "Euro-medieval" in tone and atmosphere that I didn't list, though they still vary rather wildly.

Luis, I think you're forgetting that the Euro-medieval areas of the Forgotten Realms have always been more popular.

 

[glass]

Rest assured, most of us appreciate your presence here, and your honesty. Please don't let a shrieking and ill-mannered minority chase you away.

Seconded (or thirded, or ninthed... ).


glass.

 

[JoeGKushner]

I wonder if Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil was considered for 'logical' purposes. I mean you don't get more Greyhawk than that.

 

[grodog]

I agree 110% that the use of Greyhawk as "core" or "default" should end. Personally, I treat all 3X Greyhawk references as canon, as much as any other prior, published Greyhawk specific references. Moreso, given the statements in the D&D Gazateer. To that end, and seeing no one else doing so, I've been cataloging the 3X GH references for my own use, following Jason Zavoda's previous, and phenominal, example. Doing so has been unsettling from a contextual standpoint. 3X Greyhawk references rarely support each other in a consistent fashion. In slightly more cases, they are contradictory. However, in the vast majority of cases, they simply ignore one another, going off in myriad directions simultaneously and aimlessly. The result is like an increasingly overgrown hedge that I despair ever being pruned. A hedge that threatens to swallow up the other landscaping.

Very interesting observation, GVD! Are you willing to share your 3.x index?

 

[grodog]

And becoming something FR is not, IMO, very likely entails significant change to what people have come to understand as GH. The trick will be to change GH enough to draw a new audience, rather than cannibalizing FR's audience, while at the same time preserving those things that make Greyhawk Greyhawk to the largest number of people possible.

Perhaps the sales comparison between EtCG and EtUM is the test: does having a GH megadungeon in print positively or negatively impact the sales of the FR flagship dungeon, even when that dungeon is released prior to the GH one (i.e., it gets a head start)?

 

[grodog]

I think you have been very open in your thoughts about Greyhawk as you have expressed them here and that is very much appreciated. I hope you will not be overly put off when some Greyhawkers let their passion and sense of "long suffering" get the best of them. I think there is a tremendous opportunity for Wotc to partner with Greyhawk and its fans in a way that will work to everyone's benefit and interests.

I'll second that. The fact that you're here, discussing---and defending---GH, Scott, is about 6.02x10^23 more interest than we've seen WotC show in GH publication (outside of the RPGA) since the LGG was published prior to the release of 3.0.

Ideally, Wotc can find a way to produce or license a new vision of GH that will find an audience, new and not just old, and thereby be very profitable. This is not a thread for suggesting ideas to Wotc but perhaps it would be a thought to have a design contest much like the one that produced Eberron - "How would you redesign the World of Greyhawk campaign setting for publication?"

Now that's a wonderful idea, GVD! Perhaps that should be the topic for the next postfest on Canonfire!