Looking for level based defense progressions

[Ace]

I have a conundrum -- I looking to run a humanocentric -- reduced magic and magic item D20 ish campaign in the near future

Unfortunately I am having trouble with selecting a level based defense progrssions --

Can anyone suggest (and if possible post) a few OGL based level defense progressions that might be balanced with the following guidelines

3 extra feats over 20 levels

magic items on an add hoc basis (probably half or less but they should add power rather than balance charcters, a powerbaseline should take into account no magic items or masterwork gear )

2 extra skill points a level

 

[Prince of Happiness]

I have a conundrum -- I looking to run a humanocentric -- reduced magic and magic item D20 ish campaign in the near future

Unfortunately I am having trouble with selecting a level based defense progrssions --

Can anyone suggest (and if possible post) a few OGL based level defense progressions that might be balanced with the following guidelines

3 extra feats over 20 levels

magic items on an add hoc basis (probably half or less but they should add power rather than balance charcters, a powerbaseline should take into account no magic items or masterwork gear )

2 extra skill points a level

I've seen systems for level-based defense progression in Unearthed Arcana and in Mongoose's Conan d20 game.

 

[Ace]

I've seen systems for level-based defense progression in Unearthed Arcana and in Mongoose's Conan d20 game.

Thanks ! I don't have acess to those books

I have seen progrssions in several books including Wheel of Time, Starwars, Spycraft and Swashbuckling adventures -- I just don't want to but those books just for a tidbit ---

I haven't the space

 

[Zoatebix]

Don't forget d20 Modern, the oldie but goodie Second World Sourcebook, and the wonderful Grim Tales. Arsenal had a class-based defense progression in it, too. All of these are open source. Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed has two classes with Defense Progressions as well.

Personally - I use three flavors of progressions, the formulas for which are as follows:

Poor: 1/3 plus 1/3 per level
Average: 1/2 plus 1/2 per level
Good: 2/3 plus 2/3 per level

So Poor gives you +7 AC over 20 levels, Average gives you +10, and Good gives you +14.

I have a slew of core classes from various sources in my game, but if I were to adopt the system to the PHB...

Barbarian: Poor
Bard: Average
Cleric: Poor
Druid: Poor
Fighter: Good
Monk: Good (plus they get their wisdom bonus to AC)
Paladin: Average
Ranger: Average
Rogue: Good
Sorcerer: Average
Wizard: Average

And with all classes getting 3 extra feats of 20 levels, and all classes getting two extra skill points per level, I think that'll work out fine. In fact, rogues in my Campaign already get 10 skill points per level...

Monsters won't need a boost to AC. You can set up the class bonus to AC to interact with armor however you want. Armor reduces damage in my gameEven though you're limiting magic items, you should probably play a *little* bit with the stacking rules with regard to AC. Maybe call the shield AC bonus a "deflection bonuses," I don't know. The Second World Sourcebook talks a lot about how rules interact - it may have useful advice for you.

Anyways, if you'd like more suggestions, I'll be checking back here. I hope this helps!
-George

 

[Ace]

Don't forget d20 Modern, the oldie but goodie Second World Sourcebook, and the wonderful Grim Tales. Arsenal had a class-based defense progression in it, too. All of these are open source. Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed has two classes with Defense Progressions as well.

Personally - I use three flavors of progressions, the formulas for which are as follows:

Poor: 1/3 plus 1/3 per level
Average: 1/2 plus 1/2 per level
Good: 2/3 plus 2/3 per level

So Poor gives you +7 AC over 20 levels, Average gives you +10, and Good gives you +14.

I have a slew of core classes from various sources in my game, but if I were to adopt the system to the PHB...

Barbarian: Poor
Bard: Average
Cleric: Poor
Druid: Poor
Fighter: Good
Monk: Good (plus they get their wisdom bonus to AC)
Paladin: Average
Ranger: Average
Rogue: Good
Sorcerer: Average
Wizard: Average

And with all classes getting 3 extra feats of 20 levels, and all classes getting two extra skill points per level, I think that'll work out fine. In fact, rogues in my Campaign already get 10 skill points per level...

Monsters won't need a boost to AC. You can set up the class bonus to AC to interact with armor however you want. Armor reduces damage in my gameEven though you're limiting magic items, you should probably play a *little* bit with the stacking rules with regard to AC. Maybe call the shield AC bonus a "deflection bonuses," I don't know. The Second World Sourcebook talks a lot about how rules interact - it may have useful advice for you.

Anyways, if you'd like more suggestions, I'll be checking back here. I hope this helps!
-George

yes it does ! Thanks!

the only thing is though I don't quote understand the formulas ---

 

[Roman]

Don't forget d20 Modern, the oldie but goodie Second World Sourcebook, and the wonderful Grim Tales. Arsenal had a class-based defense progression in it, too. All of these are open source. Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed has two classes with Defense Progressions as well.

Personally - I use three flavors of progressions, the formulas for which are as follows:

Poor: 1/3 plus 1/3 per level
Average: 1/2 plus 1/2 per level
Good: 2/3 plus 2/3 per level

So Poor gives you +7 AC over 20 levels, Average gives you +10, and Good gives you +14.

I have a slew of core classes from various sources in my game, but if I were to adopt the system to the PHB...

Barbarian: Poor
Bard: Average
Cleric: Poor
Druid: Poor
Fighter: Good
Monk: Good (plus they get their wisdom bonus to AC)
Paladin: Average
Ranger: Average
Rogue: Good
Sorcerer: Average
Wizard: Average

And with all classes getting 3 extra feats of 20 levels, and all classes getting two extra skill points per level, I think that'll work out fine. In fact, rogues in my Campaign already get 10 skill points per level...

Monsters won't need a boost to AC. You can set up the class bonus to AC to interact with armor however you want. Armor reduces damage in my gameEven though you're limiting magic items, you should probably play a *little* bit with the stacking rules with regard to AC. Maybe call the shield AC bonus a "deflection bonuses," I don't know. The Second World Sourcebook talks a lot about how rules interact - it may have useful advice for you.

Anyways, if you'd like more suggestions, I'll be checking back here. I hope this helps!
-George

Although the principle is good I disagree about which classes would get which AC progression. I would do the following:

Barbarian: Average or Good
Bard: Average
Cleric: Poor or Average
Druid: Poor or Average
Fighter: Good
Monk: Good
Paladin: Average
Ranger: Average
Rogue: Good
Sorcerer: Poor
Wizard: Poor

 

[Ace]

Although the principle is good I disagree about which classes would get which AC progression. I would do the following:

Barbarian: Average or Good
Bard: Average
Cleric: Poor or Average
Druid: Poor or Average
Fighter: Good
Monk: Good
Paladin: Average
Ranger: Average
Rogue: Good
Sorcerer: Poor
Wizard: Poor

My progression will be based on BAB more or less

Poor BAB -- Poor defense

Medium BAB -- Medium Defense

Good BAB -- Good Defense

I son't plan on using the Monk or anything like it but if I did it would be Good defense

I am not sure but I think between 6 and 8 should be the poor cap, 9 and 11 the medium and 12 to 14 the good cap -- I am just not quite sure which or how

 

[Zoatebix]

I gave the wizard and sorcerer "average" and the cleric and druid "poor" because clerics and druids get armor. Plus - "average" defense bonus is another thing that sorcerers and wizards can "give up" for when they take an (obviously superior to pure sorcerer) prestige class. I really personally think that the arcane casters are better off from a playability standpoint with "average" defense.

The barbarian defense is fine as "average" - the "berserker" class in my game is slightly tweaked (and based on the whirling frenzy variant from Unearthed Arcana) and the "poor" progression balances it better, even if it doesn't make as much sense from a player's perspecitve.

The formulas mean that at level one - Good and Average classes have a defense bonus of +1 at first leve (you round the total of one and one third from "Good" down), and the Poor classes have a defense bonus of +0 (you round the two thirds (one third plus one third per level at first level) down to 0).

Is that a better explaination? So the 20 level progression (rounded down) for good would be:
Lvl Def
1 +1
2 +2
3 +2
4 +3
5 +4
6 +4
7 +5
8 +6
9 +6
10 +7
11 +8
12 +8
13 +9
14 +10
15 +10
16 +11
17 +12
18 +12
19 +13
20 +14

Anyways - I have to go to dinner. I'll be back!
-George

 

[Acid_crash]

I'm gonna snatch this idea for my game I plan on running in a couple months, along with armor as damage reduction instead of bonus to AC.

 

[Kax Tuglebend]

i've been contemplating trying something similar myself, but i cant be having with all that assigning progression to classes, so i'll probably just try:

(player gets to choose which method of defence he is relying on each turn)
Parrying (using a weapon to block incoming blows): Defence: 10 + BAB + Str bonus

Dodging (just trying not to get hit): Defence: 10 + Base Ref Save + Dex Bonus