Magic Weapons and upgrades

[wolfen]

I totally agree that signiture weapons have a fantastic appeal to players and can be a great part of a campaign.

But wouldn't it be be better to allow the PC's access to a master weaponsmith who specializes in Dwarven Axes, rather than have a rule that diminishes the RP value of weapons by allowing them to be "upgraded" easier and faster than a Windows patch?

I know this is only personal opinion, but that rule really seems to trivialize the wonder and uniqueness of magical weapons.

Not only can you have the mage hold the weapon for some time to emphasize the event, but you don't have to make it easy to find a willing/able mage, either.

For example, there may be mages who demand some proof of the warrior's worth. Maybe they only assist warriors of specific castes, alignments, religions, etc...so as to not unbalance power in the region. "How do I know you won't use it to undo everything I stand for?" asks the enchanter. There are all kinds of interesting reasons that it might be difficult to get your upgrade done.

In addition, let's follow your logic. Is a magic weapon more special by having more of them around? I mean, if you had very few magic weapons that could be upgraded, or many more weapons that could not, isn't it more "special" to have fewer?

But I think you may be hitting upon the idea that a weapon was created special and that "upgrading" it may be akin to some sort of disrespect or affront to the weapon, your world, and magic. That sounds like a great reason for a mage to resist upgrading weapons willy nilly, doesn't it? I mean, if you KNEW you couldn't go through the drive-thru McWeapon store and get your upgrade, wouldn't you respect the process more? And wouldn't that special sword you have be even MORE special? Because you'd know how difficult it would be to replace it if it's already a +2 Flaming long sword. Jeeez, you'd hold on tight and hope some enchanter finds you worthy of a +HOLY upgrade some day, for example.


wolfen

 

[Brown Jenkin]

Coming from a players perspective I feel that upgrading your weapon and allowing a character to keep the same weapon is great. I have been in two long d20 campaigns that went in different directions regarding this.

The first campaign did not utilize weapon advancement because no one took crafting feats and comissioning an item required 1/2 up front and months to complete. I used a Dwarven Waraxe as my favorite weapon including spending feats on its use. From a player's perspective once you spend feats on something you better be able to use it. Being an exotic weapon you wouldn't expect to find many of these laying around in treasure piles, especially magic ones. This puts my DM in a bind however since he must either continually place better Dwarven Waraxes around all the time or I must be without my primary weapon for a long time (This can be worked around by alternating magic Waraxes but that is very expensive and always leaves you with a lesser weapon compared to others). The DM opted to leave better axes laying around but that always rang of a setup and always diminished the feeling of a cohearent campaign world. My old DM sometimes reads these boards so let me add that overall I did enjoy his campaign, this is just one of a few small areas that could have been better.

Our current camaign With a different DM is set in a L5R/Forgotten Realms mix. For more info please read Black Omega's Rokugan story hour. Any bonus XP for the plug? The Rokugan method (AEG's Rokugan d20 campaign book) is different to deal with asian sensibilities. There are no large piles of gold and looting dead bodies is unclean. Instead they use a variation on the Dragon Magazine/OA weapon advancement methods which use gold and instead use XP to increase your weapon. Additionally most magic items are spontaniously awakened spirits within a item that will only work for the owner which also makes the need for looting dead bodies pointless. Using these methods the DM is able to keep the character wealth levels apropriate without the need for looting and giant piles of gold. From a players perspective I have found this to be a great system. I control my weapons abilities but not the other magic items I get (the DM decides what awakens and with what powers). There is still a sense of surprise and specialness about magic items since as a player I don't know what or when I will get a item but once I do it is my item. My weapon on the other hand is mine for life (And even more valuable since if I lose it I must spend all the XP again to get another one) since my character has a special bond with it and as a Player it is the one thing I have crontrol over. This has alowed the campaign to revolve around the main story arcs and not be bogged down with concearns about how are we going to get the magic items we want or need.

Having played both types of campaigns I can say that allowing weapon advancement and player control over this process is great. I don't understand the DM need for control over everything, my character is already enough at the mercy of the DM as it is. The way d20 works is that a characters weapon is inevitably tied to the character through feats, and this is part of the players area. The player should be deciding what how they want thier character to advance not the DM, the DM in turn should be figuring out what they want the characters to experience as part of thier campaign world. As for tracking down someone/something as part of a quest to improve your weapon that might be fun once or twice but the camapian can't revolve around this, and it will if you always need to do this to upgrade your weapons. I want a campaign with some sort of purpose not just a colection of side quests that I run through whose only purpose is to get the party equipment improved so that they will be ready for the next quest to improve the equipment and so on. I think it is great for a character to have a signature weapon in the style of Excalibur but without the problems of giving a character a +5 weapon at the start of the campaign. As mentioned before always finding a new version of your weapon type dilutes the campaign world for me.

 

[TuDogz]

The weapon advancement methods sound interesting for a campaign I'm starting. Which dragon/dragons out line them?

 

[kreynolds]

If you mean weapons that level or "gain experience", Dragon 289.

 

[TuDogz]

quote:
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If you mean weapons that level or "gain experience", Dragon 289.
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Thats what I meant. Thanks kreynolds!

 

[Mystery Man]

The weapon advancement methods sound interesting for a campaign I'm starting. Which dragon/dragons out line them?

Swords of Our Fathers is an excellent example of how weapons can gain abilities over time.

I don't understand the DM need for control over everything, my character is already enough at the mercy of the DM as it is.

Hence the original intent of my question. I would rather my players have control over some aspects of the game. Plus I'm not a mind reader.