Mearls redesigns the Ogre Mage

[Pants]

Nowhere does it mention being a cunning leader of other ogres. I am not sure where this portrayal comes from.

I just checked my 2e Monstrous Manual and there is no real mention of Ogre Mages leading other Ogres or manipulating humanoids with their SLA's. In fact, they usually live in caves with other Ogre Mages, keep humanoids as slaves, and tattoo their tribe's symbols on their foreheads or their backs.

 

[vermicious knid]

I really like the idea of "casts as a level X caster" so that it's easy to beef up a monster by adding associated class levels. For example, if an Ogre-Mage had 10 Giant HD and cast as a 6th level something (Sorcerer, Beguiler, Binder, Warlock, whatever) then it would be a nice CR 8 encounter, and would have obvious potential for custimization / enhancement.

-- N

I'd be perfectly happy with a 6 HD Ogre Mage that casts as a 6th level sorceror. Could be a manipulator or a rear rank artillery piece depending on spell choice. Scales easily with additional class levels.

I would/will drop the spell-like abilities and flight and go with that. I don't much care for one-trick ponys.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Heh, as if it's not tedious enough already to fully stat out an important NPC, much more so the semi-important ones. I can really go without having to stat up monsters with class levels, too, to be honest. D&D is my hobby, not my life-consuming vocation.

 

[Glyfair]

I just checked my 2e Monstrous Manual and there is no real mention of Ogre Mages leading other Ogres or manipulating humanoids with their SLA's. In fact, they usually live in caves with other Ogre Mages, keep humanoids as slaves, and tattoo their tribe's symbols on their foreheads or their backs.

Even back to OD&D it's clear they are different:

OGRE MAGI: These are properly Japanese Ogres, far more powerful than their Western cousins! An Ogre Mage has the following abilities in addition to those of a normal ogre: 1) become invisible; 2) fly, as a Flying spell allows; 3) cause darkness in a 1" radius; 4) polymorph itself into a human form; 5) regenerate at 1 point/melee round; 6) employ a single Charm Person and a single Sleep spell once per day; and 7) use a Cold spell of 8 dice value once per day. These abominations typically lure or raid for human victims to pillage, devour, or enslave.

To me, it reads like the DM special that were common at the time, where you threw a monster at the party, let them make assumptions, and then it was something different. The party is prepared for a monsterous melee combat and suddenly realize the monster can cast spells, is best at range, and is far more powerful than the players expect.

I'll note there is no picture or description of the Ogre Mage in Greyhawk. We don't get that until AD&D.

(BTW, for those Greyhawk fanatics, I'm curious exactly where in Greyhawk Japan is. These are noted as being from the East, and I just don't see anything to the East.)

 

[The Shaman]

They make way better cowards than manipulators. It's just sort of pointless.

My 1e AD&D ogre mage story...

Passing through a small village, the adventurers learned that a hobgoblin tribe was exacting a ruinous tribute on the humble, hardworking villagers. The village headman appealed to the adventurers for help in defending the village from the hobgoblins, and the adventurers agreed. (I blatantly ripped off Seven Samurai as my set-up.)

When the hobgoblins arived to demand tribute, the adventurers and the villagers were waiting, and after an exchange of taunts, the hobgoblins attacked. Unbeknownst to the party, the leader of the hobgoblins was a polymorphed ogre mage who had charmed several of the villagers to waylay the adventurers once the battle began - the ogre mage turned invisible when the battle began and subsequently wasted the party wizard with his ray of cold. The only adventurer to escape was the thief - the wizard died, and the rest of the party was captured.

The ogre mage knew all of the defenses, flying around the village while invisible in the days before the attack - from the charmed villagers he learned the adventurers' tactics in advance as well. He put himself in position to cause the maximum harm at the least risk to himself once the battle began.

Coward? No. Devious adversary? Most definitely.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

(BTW, for those Greyhawk fanatics, I'm curious exactly where in Greyhawk Japan is. These are noted as being from the East, and I just don't see anything to the East.)

Presumably the same place that the samurai player class from in The Strategic Review (or perhaps The Dragon). Having fun was more important than worldbuilding, once upon a time.

 

[Glyfair]

Presumably the same place that the samurai player class from in The Strategic Review (or perhaps The Dragon). Having fun was more important than worldbuilding, once upon a time.

But the samurai class wasn't tied into Greyhawk. This book was, if not exactly the campaign setting.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

But the samurai class wasn't tied into Greyhawk. This book was, if not exactly the campaign setting.

Eh. I've got the little Greyhawk booklet, and it's a stretch to call it a campaign setting, IMO. It's more "EGG ran out of names, come up with something evocative for this sourcebook," IMO.

 

[occam]

Replace troublesome polymorph to "shapshifter:alternate form-any medium or large humanoid-form and gain +10 to disguise to impersonate individual"

This has already effectively been done in the errata:

Remove polymorph from spell-like abilities.
Change Shape (Su): An ogre mage can assume the form of any Small, Medium, or Large humanoid or giant.

 

[Simm]

I'm fine with the old version, which I never used, and I'm fine with the updated version, which I will probably never use, but one ability worries me.

A CR 5 monster is carrying more than 16 000 gp worth of equipment, I mean how many large chain shirts +4 are out there anyway. They can't make them themselves. If a party defeats one and happens to have a large member the balance of the game shifted with one battle.