Mexican Stand-off: How To?

[RangerWickett]

One of my favorite scenes from cinema is the three-way stand-off at the end of The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly, and for my modern game I have this crazy idea of the penultimate fight of the campaign ending in a similar way. I'm wondering how to make this work.

Quick set up:

First, understand that this campaign is unusual, combining all sorts of myths in odd ways. The PCs will be looking for the Holy Grail, which is located at Trinity Site, the location where they tested the first atomic bomb. It's the modern day, but they need the Holy Grail to save the world, and if they manage to get the Holy Grail, they will go on to the final conflict of the campaign (which will take place in either England in a vampire-infested Isle of Avalon, or in Japan at a demonic shogun's palace).

There will be two other groups who want the Holy Grail too. One group will be represented by human mages dressed in slick black suits, powerful with attack magic and possessing powers over demons and fey creatures. Leading the group is a powerful warlock, who looks like Christian Bale.

They're the Bad.


Then there's the ghost posse, a group of spectral mercenaries sent to defeat the party and bring back the treasure. The ghosts are all Western-themed, and the leader is an actual picture-perfect version of Tuco:

They're the Ugly.

(If you've read my storyhour of this campaign, you know that all the major PCs and NPCs look surprisingly similar to famous actors.)


And then there are the PCs, who are out to save the world -- not so much because they care about the world, but more because they don't want the bad guys, who are ***holes, getting their way. One of the PCs is a gunslinger, a grizzled man who can take a beating. He might look a little familiar.

They're the Good.



How, though, could I possibly wrangle a three-way Mexican stand-off? I mean, first of all, it's hard to get the three groups together at the same time. Then there's the problem of getting them to not just start fighting right away -- how can I encourage the group to get that excellent racheting tension of looking from foe to foe? And finally, how can I end the fight quickly, preferably in one round?

I'm thinking, tentatively, that the PCs reach the area first, and locate a glass-strewn desert that was Ground Zero, sixty years ago. The Holy Grail is buried under the glass, but due to the devastatingly destructive power unleashed by the bomb, no magical healing works in the area. This should discourage the group's feeling of invincibility.

As they reach ground zero of Trinity Site, they have to fight the ghost posse (minus Tuco), who are waiting in ambush. You can see the Grail, buried in the glass just below the surface, glowing with magic. It grows steadily more intense during the fight, and either by itself, or with the aid of a PC lending it some power, it flashes with energy and obliterates the ghosts. Preferably this happens when there are only one or two PCs anywhere near being in a condition to keep fighting.

They feel they've won, and they're about to claim their prize, when Tuco arrives and fires a gunshot at their feet, driving them back from the Grail. They will have already faced this guy once or twice, so they should know he's too powerful for them to take on their own. Tuco growls out in a Mexican accent that he'll be taking the Grail. But just as he's about to make a move for it, the warlock appears. He tells them all to back away, and . . . he'll have some manner of device that the group will know is like a one-shot ghost-debilitator. Dragon essence.

The party just dislikes Tuco, but they hate Christian Bale. However, they know that they can't take Tuco on their own. What do they do? Then they notice that the Grail's is starting to glow again, slowly building to another blast that will give them a chance.

Hopefully.



Any suggestions?

 

[LostSoul]

How, though, could I possibly wrangle a three-way Mexican stand-off? I mean, first of all, it's hard to get the three groups together at the same time. Then there's the problem of getting them to not just start fighting right away -- how can I encourage the group to get that excellent racheting tension of looking from foe to foe? And finally, how can I end the fight quickly, preferably in one round?

I don't think d20 handles this sort of thing very well. Its strength is in tactical combat, not cinematic scenes. Players of d20 systems will want to grab the advantage as soon as possible, and not wait around to stare at each other and spit in the dirt.

Of course, it's just a matter of flavour, since you have to roll initiative in the first place. But you don't get any benefit for doing that stare-down to start off with, and the rest of the game promotes speed and efficiency, cutting to the quick.

You might do something like allowing the Intimidate skill (that one demoralizing thing) to be used outside of combat. But then you'll get into debates about when Initiative should be rolled. Maybe have some rounds before combat for this sort of thing. BUT - if the PCs don't get an advantage for doing it, they won't. (Unless they'd do it anyway, in which case you don't have to do anything.)

So your best bet is to just describe the scene and hope your players get into it. Would be better with mechanics.

 

[Hypersmurf]

What if a side effect of the flares grants some sort of Sanctuary effect to everyone? +10 to saves and AC, for example, that vanishes when you attack.

Whoever attacks first has to overcome that protection. Whoever attacks second doesn't.

-Hyp.

 

[Nuclear Platypus]

Doh! Hypersmurf beat me to it. My idea was likewise a MacGuffin-ish idea. Going along with his smurfy idea, how about lowering the MDT to make it into a John Woo gunfight? Mooks go down easy while named characters (PCs and major bad guys) can take a few more hits. Handwave it as a side effect of the Grail - needs blood / lifeforce to recharge itself to work - kinda like how it worked in Demon Knight.

Don't forget to play the music to The Good, the Bad and the Ugly or have a tumbleweed roll by.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Hmmm...

Interesting ideas and very cinematic indeed. I think as soon as you roll iniative, it all becomes about who can act first and thus kill the opponent/s. This obviously needs to be the second part of the plan when the three groups know what they intend to do.

The first part, the cinematic part is the actual standoff. This just as obviously needs to be done before initiative is rolled. The question becomes, how do you stop the three groups from acting? The first I suppose is by having the "ugly" in position but not threatening the "good" directly. You need hesitation by the "good"; doubt needs to be in their mind.

The appearance of the "bad" should further that hesitation and doubt. For this to work, the player's: the "good" need to be little fonzies here. No big heroics before the standoff can achieve it's dramatic climax. They should feel threatened - as if one wrong move will end their existence. However, they should also see that they need to come to an agreement with either the bad or the ugly. Who's going to team up? What are the other side's going to do. By waiting the longest, can they improve their chances of survival?

That's a lot to do before rolling initiative but for the standoff to work, it's going to be what has to happen. Delay, delay, delay the call for rolling initiative as long as possible. You as the DM can control two of the sides and by controlling the environment, you can get the PCs to hesitate long enough to pull it off. Hopefully. Its all about being a group of little fonzies.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[LostSoul]

Whoever attacks first has to overcome that protection. Whoever attacks second doesn't.

Doesn't that mean that all characters present will wait until the others attack? There's no sense in moving in first. It's almost as bad as giving up a full-round's worth of actions. I don't think that would create tension - it would be more like a waiting game. Maybe I'm missing something.

Unless there is something else going on. Something else could create tension.

What if you combined the Sanctuary with some kind of random, damaging element, like an earthquake or something? Nope, won't work. In that case, PCs do a quick analysis: will we be in a better state if we wait, or if we attack now? (Do we have more hp/defenses than the other guy? If so, wait. If not, attack. No tension.)

This is a really interesting question. I look forward to seeing what comes out of it!

 

[SWBaxter]

How, though, could I possibly wrangle a three-way Mexican stand-off?

Well - one thing to remember (spoiler for "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly" follows... )

Spoiler

... is that it's not really a three-way standoff in the movie. Though only Eastwood's character knows that Tuco's gun is empty, and hence it's really a head to head Mexican stand-off.

That said, the only way I've had much luck arranging standoff situations in D&D is to introduce some maguffin that all parties want, and dangling it in front of them. This generally makes them pause, since they can either go for the maguffin or attack their enemy, and I try to make it clear that while one of those will work out best, there's no clear way to tell which one. That's a tad tricky, though. Like a lot of the really dramatic scenes, you need some player cooperation to pull it off.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Doesn't that mean that all characters present will wait until the others attack? There's no sense in moving in first. It's almost as bad as giving up a full-round's worth of actions. I don't think that would create tension - it would be more like a waiting game. Maybe I'm missing something.

Well, the PCs know another flare is coming... eventually.

Tuco didn't see how the last flare affected ghosts.

Tuco thinks he can take the PCs... but maybe not if he attacks first. He might still pull it off, but that wasted round will hurt.

The PCs think they can take Tuco... if they can avoid combat until the flare occurs, without giving Tuco reason to leave the affected radius.

Christian Bale knows he can hurt Tuco badly, but that there's a good chance his Ghost Debilitator won't overcome the Sanctuary. But if he waits until the flare goes off, the PCs might see Tuco as less of an immediate threat, and he knows they hate him. So it's in his interest to get combat initiated between Tuco and the PCs before the flare goes off, without attacking anyone himself first. If he manages that, and times it right, he can help Tuco finish off the PCs just before the flare goes off. Then the flare goes off, Tuco gets badly hurt, and Christian Bale polishes him off with the dragon essence and gets the grail.

So Christian Bale's aim is to provoke someone - anyone - into attacking someone. Even into attacking him. If the PCs attack him, Tuco attacks the PCs. If Tuco attacks him, the PCs attack Tuco. He should be fast-talking, making promises, making threats, telling lies, anything to get someone to make the first move. He needs to point out to the PCs that the Sanctuary doesn't make Tuco invulnerable, and that they outnumber him, and one of them might get a lucky shot in that gets past the protection and distracts him so Christian can use the Dragon Essence. Or he needs to point out to Tuco that the PCs have just finished a hard fight, and together the two of them can take them despite the protection... all the while winking at the PCs where Tuco can't see.

-Hyp.

 

[LostSoul]

Brilliant!

 

[RangerWickett]

Nice ideas. Now all I need to do is get Tuco to kick a bit more butt before he vanishes for a while. He's been invincible once. He needs to be invincible and dangerous the next time. Then set it up so that the third effort actually has a chance of defeating him.

Likewise with Christian Bale. They faced him once and he talked his way out of it. I should have them come across some of their friends, dead by his hand.

And I need to get the group to watch The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly soon. Sure, this particular event probably won't happen for months, but I want to make sure we all appreciate that scene before I try to pull this off.

And, of course, there's always the chance the PCs will completely screw with my plans, by, like, charging as soon as the guy shows up, or making fart jokes. But hey, I've managed to run with it before.