D&D 5E (2024) Mike Mearls explains why your boss monsters die too easily

[UngeheuerLich]

Goblin minions dont have ranged attacks.

They have daggers... And dex 14.

And they can just run away and come back 1 min later.

 

[Zardnaar]

They have daggers... And dex 14.

And they can just run away and come back 1 min later.

They have a dagger?

 

[Distracted DM]

I don't know if I've ever run goblins without some sort of ranged attack even if it was slings or hucking gross stuff/stones. Typically though they have some short bows.
Side note, I wish slings were more prominent!

 

[UngeheuerLich]

They have a dagger?

Actions
Dagger. Melee or Ranged Attack Roll: +4, reach 5 ft. or range 20/60 ft. Hit: 4 (1d4 + 2) Piercing damage.

Yes.

20ft ranged. Just enough to not get into spirit guardians.
Or using nimble escape to hide and attack with advantage to cancel disadvantage at 60ft. to be extra safe.

 

[Minigiant]

I think people are missing my point I'm
It's not that you'd be expected to fight 100 goblins

It's that goblins in D&D in 0e, 1e, 2e, 3e, and 5e are:

1. Mostly Stupid
2. Mostly Poor
3. Mostly Noncombat, Underworld, or Martial
4. Have Low tech primitive resources and equipment
5. Have no ability to summon allies
6. Have very few casters
7. Have very few craftspeople

So they are very very vulnerable to hit and run tactics because their available resources within a few days are mostly finite, weak, and limited.

Same with orcs, bandits, raiders, beasts, most noncaster monstrosities, lesser giants, hobgoblins in early editions,

Only in 4e and 5.5e were goblins assumed to have a healthy amount of casters, craftspersons, and connections.

So for most editions, every goblin, orc, bandit, ogre, cultist you kill is not being replaced in power in 12 hours. Probably not for several days at best. Sauron and Saruman had forts and engines fueling their orc armies. Kill 10 orcs and 10 more are behind them and 20 behind them sent from Mordor. Warhammer orcs grow their recruitment right out the ground.

But D&D defaults to lone tribes of low tech idiots who reproduce.luke humans.

The 5MWD is converting from PC attrition to Enemy attrition.

Ultimately Boss fights are anticlimactic in 5.0e because without time pressure, most bosses are vulnerable to PCs who manipulate the encounter per day expectation.

4e and 5.5e reduce that by having tribals being more magical and having more extra planar allies. Goblins come with many goblin hexers and have fey allies.

 

[Minigiant]

I don't know if I've ever run goblins without some sort of ranged attack even if it was slings or hucking gross stuff/stones. Typically though they have some short bows.
Side note, I wish slings were more prominent!

See

That's the problem...
Most DMs run monsters that would be wrecked by better prepared, more offensive minded adventurers.

The main thing that makes fights tough is lack of or saving of resources.

 

[Zardnaar]

I think people are missing my point I'm
It's not that you'd be expected to fight 100 goblins

It's that goblins in D&D in 0e, 1e, 2e, 3e, and 5e are:

1. Mostly Stupid
2. Mostly Poor
3. Mostly Noncombat, Underworld, or Martial
4. Have Low tech primitive resources and equipment
5. Have no ability to summon allies
6. Have very few casters
7. Have very few craftspeople

So they are very very vulnerable to hit and run tactics because their available resources within a few days are mostly finite, weak, and limited.

Same with orcs, bandits, raiders, beasts, most noncaster monstrosities, lesser giants, hobgoblins in early editions,

Only in 4e and 5.5e were goblins assumed to have a healthy amount of casters, craftspersons, and connections.

So for most editions, every goblin, orc, bandit, ogre, cultist you kill is not being replaced in power in 12 hours. Probably not for several days at best. Sauron and Saruman had forts and engines fueling their orc armies. Kill 10 orcs and 10 more are behind them and 20 behind them sent from Mordor. Warhammer orcs grow their recruitment right out the ground.

But D&D defaults to lone tribes of low tech idiots who reproduce.luke humans.

The 5MWD is converting from PC attrition to Enemy attrition.

Ultimately Boss fights are anticlimactic in 5.0e because without time pressure, most bosses are vulnerable to PCs who manipulate the encounter per day expectation.

4e and 5.5e reduce that by having tribals being more magical and having more extra planar allies. Goblins come with many goblin hexers and have fey allies.

Yes.

20ft ranged. Just enough to not get into spirit guardians.
Or using nimble escape to hide and attack with advantage to cancel disadvantage at 60ft. to be extra safe.

I meant how much ammo they have.

5.5 DMG also says dont do that in regards to goblin minion spam.

Every edition has some low CR/xp critter that punches above its weight if you throw heaps at a party.

At higher levels its usually some CR2 or 3 with a nasty AoE eg fireball or he'll hound. Or some DM special finding some low CR spellcaster and swapping soell load out.

Cheesing terrains another trick.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I meant how much ammo they have.

Why don't you say that?
As many as needed.

But they can throw stones as well. 1d4+2 damage. +2 attack bonus. Not great, but ok.

5.5 DMG also says dont do that in regards to goblin minion spam.

No. It says, be careful. We had that a lot of times.

But we know. Only encounters that faviur your builds are OK by the rules.

Every edition has some low CR/xp critter that punches above its weight if you throw heaps at a party.

Area damage helps.

At higher levels its usually some CR2 or 3 with a nasty AoE eg fireball or he'll hound. Or some DM special finding some low CR spellcaster and swapping soell load out.

Yeah. Annyoing, isn't it?

Cheesing terrains another trick.

Oh no, only players are allowed to use cheesy tactics.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Enemies making preparations, calling reinforcements and advancing their nefarious plots whilst the PCs rest is obviously something that should happen. I just feel that significant developments that actually matter are hella lot easier to narratively justify with the week long long rests than the normal eight hour ones. Often the situation is that the enemies are already prepared for someone attacking them, so if they could significantly improve their position in a few hours, they would have already done so.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Enemies making preparations, calling reinforcements and advancing their nefarious plots whilst the PCs rest is obviously something that should happen. I just feel that significant developments that actually matter are hella lot easier to narratively justify with the week long long rests than the normal eight hour ones. Often the situation is that the enemies are already prepared for someone attacking them, so if they could significantly improve their position in a few hours, they would have already done so.

Kinda the real question is: Can they do more than the the spells and abilities can do that the players get back by resting?
The best option might really be: Leave the area. But giving up your base of operations isn't something trivially done, usually, either. It's home, it's a place you thought you'd be safe - how long until you find another one that is just as good? The Goblins leaving with their treasure seems like a nice Gotcha until the Ranger starts looking for tracks of the Goblins carrying those treasure chests.