Minions. The DM knows 'em. Do the players?

[ebenmckay]

In the Lord of the Rings movies, you could tell the minions from the leaders.

Well, at least the audience could tell. I don't think poor Boromir caught on until the third arrow.

For the sake of dramatic tension, the audience is often privy to information that the main characters are not. I mean if it's something obvious, like a big pissed-off troll or an orc with a bone disease, yeah they probably know. But the uruk-hai who is wearing (almost) the same armor as the rest and using a bow? I don't think Boromir (or Aragorn until he started getting his butt handed to him) knew that one was special right off the bat.

 

[Ian O'Rourke]

Well, at least the audience could tell. I don't think poor Boromir caught on until the third arrow.

For the sake of dramatic tension, the audience is often privy to information that the main characters are not. I mean if it's something obvious, like a big pissed-off troll or an orc with a bone disease, yeah they probably know. But the uruk-hai who is wearing (almost) the same armor as the rest and using a bow? I don't think Boromir (or Aragorn until he started getting his butt handed to him) knew that one was special right off the bat.

I think that is sort of the point, many people play their games with the players being authors aware of the genre conventions and playing accordingly. Since minions are just as much a genre convention as anything else when used in certain ways they don't mind players knowing.

Not saying that's the right way to play, just that it is a way people adopt. It just becomes part of the scene framing and dramatic set-up that Orc Lord Marak isn't a minion (named enemy you see), the guards surrounding him no doubt aren't, but the small horde he sends at you first probably are.

 

[Lizard]

In every game I run -- not just D&D -- it's usually obvious contextually who the expendable mooks are. Whether its VIPER agents, stormtroopers, or level 1 goblins, a little descriptive text goes a long way.

This is not only useful from the perspective of the game, it's dramatically appropriate. When Darth Vader walked into the room, you knew he wasn't just another stormtrooper. Oh, hell no!

Further, I expect the characters, as residents of the world, to know some basics. If they see an orc festooned with skulls and shaking a staff, they can think "shaman". If they see a dozen orcs in fragments of armor, wielding a mix of rusty weapons, they can think "grunts". If they see one in particular who is large and in charge, they know he's the non-minion.

Some might say it's fun to play with expectations. But since "minion" is a dramatic template, not an in-game condition, "fooling" the players by "disguising" the orc chief as a minion is a bit of metagaming tomfoolery that hearkens back to player vs. DM days, unless there's a lot of plot behind it (the orc chief, looking to escape the battle, doffs his fine armor and dresses in the same rags as the grunts). You wouldn't have leader-type orcs trying to "trick" people into "thinking they were minions" for ambush purposs, since the orcs have no concept of "minion".

 

[hong]

The non-minion is the one with the slow-motion zoom to focus, with ominous background music.

 

[hong]

The non-minion is the one with the slow-motion zoom to focus, with ominous background music.

Background music like this

 

[Rykaar]

I have no intention of saying "These ones are minions, they die with one hit". However, what I will most likely do is describe the ones that aren't minions slightly differently because they'll probably have non-standard equipment/appearance/etc.

Let's say the PCs get attacked by a whole tribe of goblins, most of whom are minions but some of whom are the guards, the chietain, and the shaman. I might describe the scene along these lines: "The goblin tribe rushes at you en masse. Most look like ordinary goblins but a few stand out from the crowd because they are dressed in better armor and look like they know how to wield their weapons properly. One goblin is slightly bigger than the rest and is dressed in furs and a cape. The skull of an indeterminate creature rests on his head and he wields a rod topped with the skull of a rodent. He appears to be shouting orders to the others. Also, at the back of the group is a goblin wearing nothing but a loincloth. A necklace of what appear to be teeth hangs around his neck. He is chanting in his own tongue and making subtle gestures with his hands."

This ought to tell the players that some of the goblins are more important than the others. Whether or not they know that the "mob" will all die with one hit or not is immaterial in my opinion. If they were paying attention, then they'll make sure they target the soldiers, the chieftain, and the shaman first. If the "minions" manage to get in the way before they die, then all the better.

In the Raiders of Oakhurst demo, the first fight has kobold scrubs and actual skirmishers. It doesn't seem, given identical weaponry, that telling them apart would be at all easy. On the other hand, to follow your above example, there's fairly obvious visual cues. That said, when you place figures, do you use all the same type figures? If you do, you're really being disingenuous to the players. Their characters can see the difference, but they have to keep asking you?

Basically, the method you described works well as a description-only, non-mini based combat. I suppose with minis you could mention #4 and #5 look burly and #6 has flames coming out of his hands, etc. and rely on the group to remember the difference. I just think this puts the players at a disadvantage in terms of what their characters would see round by round because they have to remember numbers and their characters could just look at the enemy.

So basically where I'm going with this is I'll use the same figs for very similarly described combatants, minion or otherwise. Ghouls and Ghasts would be a non-minion old-school example. But if a caster looks like a caster and he's surrounded by guards that look like mail-clad juggernauts, the caster gets a different figure. Identifying him and actually reaching him in the battle are two different things though

 

[Stomphoof]

I personally am not going to tell my party which is which but work off visual cues based on things like "He seems to be a little less trained" ect.

 

[Korgoth]

I wouldn't tell, but like others I would use description to set certain monsters apart if it were warranted (these two have special shields, this one has a pair of firepots, etc.). The descriptions won't be definitive, but they'll be hints. I think part of good tactics for players will be conserving Encounter and Daily powers until they figure out who the "worthy opponents" are.

 

[Mort_Q]

TV / Movie minions often wear masks, so they can reuse the stunt-persons in the next scene with minor costume variations.

This could something fun to establish, and then pull the rug out from under them when they run into a boss type wearing a magical mask.

Of course, there are at least to races in Eberron that traditionally wear masks...
... whatever, just an off the cuff thought.

 

[Kaodi]

It would seem to me that the Wizard can be thought of as the Minion Detector. At least any Wizard with Area of Effect At-Wills.