Minor/Major dismemberments

[Kid Charlemagne]

I'm toying around with the idea of giving a PC some kind of benefit in extreme circumstances - with the risk being that if they fail they might lose a limb. Either that or adapt Skull & Bones "roll the bones" mechanic to allow for cheating death - but you might end up scarred or missing an extremity.

Really, I'm just trying to set them up to want to use the Hand of Vecna. How am I supposed to do that if they can't lose their own hand?

 

[Grazzt]

Save ends? As in, you've got a 55% chance of your arm popping back on before the end of the fight?

That was going to be my question. I think I'd probably remove the 'save ends' part of the power/ability. Doesn't seem to fit here...unless...limbs are an abstract thing in 4e, as mentioned above.

 

[Satori5000]

In my home group, we have something like this. We use action points and should a character take enough damage to die, we can spend an action point to stabalize and we take a major wound (something that heal can take care of). Its more of a RP thing in 3.5 because characters are loaded with money and can easily afford the spell to be cast. I dont know how things will work in 4e but i dont want there to be the chance that i have to say, be the defender, with no shield becuase i lost an arm. Like was stated above, PC's have alot better chance of having a limb removed from them.

 

[kennew142]

I was thinking more:

Severing Strike
Encounter, Weapon
Standard Action, Melee Slashing Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Strength vs. AC
Hit: 2(W), plus if you deal enough damage to bring the target to 0 hit points or lower, instead of dropping the target, you may instead elect to sever one of your target's arms at the wrist or elbow, or one of your target's legs at the ankle or knee. In this case, you reduce the target's hit points automatically to 1 and the target suffers the effects of losing his limb.

The hit effects are pretty much ripped from SWSE's Severing Strike, in the Duelist talent tree under the Jedi Knight prestige class.

I like this power. At first I was thinking that it made no sense to dismember an opponent when killing them makes more sense*. But with the prevalence of healing magic in D&D (of all flavors), it makes sense to cause a wound that disables an opponent in a way that only major healing (hopefully an out of combat ritual in 4e) can reverse.

A weaker version of the power could allow a disabling strike (nerve strike, etc...) that would disable the limb until the target saves.

*From a purely gamist sense. I can see lots of story reasons why dismembering would be more useful or desirable than killing.

 

[Goobermunch]

I've always believed that limbs in D&D represent more intangible things, like luck and heroic discipline. Or something.

*Wipes coffee from monitor*

I am firmly in the HP=luck,stamina, discipline camp. But this delivers the win.

--G

 

[ruleslawyer]

I think that severing limbs (where it's a non-trivial thing; we're not talking lizard tails or troll fingers) should be reserved as either a) an alternative to death; or b) a cost that yields a corresponding benefit.

Back in 1e days, I used to rule that PCs who were "killed" by an attacking blow could instead opt to lose a limb or suffer some time of other debilitating injury instead. The benefit was that a raise dead or resurrection spell wasn't required; the cost was the mechanical penalty for adventuring with a severed arm, gouged eye, or whatever until a cleric with regenerate (a pretty powerful spell in 1e) was located.

For 4e, I'd obviously allow a PC who deals the killing blow to choose an effect other than killing the opponent (as I've allowed since 1e; you never, ever have to kill an NPC unless you want to). As for PCs sustaining limb loss, et cetera: I guess it depends on the availability of magical healing. In my current game (Iron Heroes with some D&D-ish tweaks), healing can only be accomplished by rare, highly-skilled and/or blessed individuals (think Elrond, et cetera); such healing is at a level far beyond that of pre-modern medicine (and in some ways modern medicine), but isn't capable of doing "high F/X" things like regrowing limbs or resurrecting dead PCs.

Thus, the only way I'd inflict such an injury on my PCs would be as an alternative to death; if a PC falls and fails his save(s) to die, then he can instead choose to "just" lose a limb. As an alternative, I would certainly allow a player to elect that he lost a limb, eye, et cetera in return for some corresponding reward. What I might do in a hypothetical 4e campaign is allow a player to state that his PC, during a giant encounter, had his lower leg chopped off. This would inflict a speed penalty, and perhaps grant the PC an extra healing surge or two (he's proven himself to be *extra*-resilient and able to fight through pain) or some other ability that was mechanically sufficient to offset the penalty. In all likelihood, I'd still link limb loss to dropping into negatives, at least: People don't really stay in the fight when they've lost arms, legs, eyes, etc.

 

[Simm]

Severing Strike
Encounter, Weapon
Standard Action, Melee Slashing Weapon
Target: One Limb
Attack: Weapon vs AC
Hit: Weapon damage, and follow up STR vs Fort. If this hits, the target's limb is severed, and no actions involving that limb may be taken. Save ends.

I quite like this as an ability, even the save ends. All that's wrong with it, I think, is the name. Probably Numbing Strike or something. An attack that temporarily disables a limb is effectinve and not unrealistic. I would probably codify it more strongly.

Target
Arm: target losses the ability to make natural attacks with the limb. Target losses any shield bonus from the limb. Target cannot carry an object or weapon.
Leg: Target may not run. Targets movement is halved.
Head: Target in knocked unconscious.

 

[Warbringer]

Save ends? As in, you've got a 55% chance of your arm popping back on before the end of the fight?

No, but if you fail the second save another limb falls off

 

[Xethreau]

Back in 1e days, I used to rule that PCs who were "killed" by an attacking blow could instead opt to lose a limb or suffer some time of other debilitating injury instead. The benefit was that a raise dead or resurrection spell wasn't required; the cost was the mechanical penalty for adventuring with a severed arm, gouged eye, or whatever until a cleric with regenerate (a pretty powerful spell in 1e) was located.

I really like this idea. However, with 4e's HP and death rules, I think it might not be all that common. I think I will personally implement the rule "If an enemy would not only drop you, but bring you to enough negative HP as to kill you, you may choose to take half damage instead, and instead be maimed in some way (severed arm, gouged eye, etc." However, as I said, in 4e, it will not be all that common of an occurance... but now with a (house)rule for dismemberment and (relatively) permanent injury, I feel a lot better about the 4e death and dying system.

The more I think about it, the more I like the houserule. Thanks!