Mirror Image vs. Finger of Death

[godfear]

Page 47 of FAQ:

"Area spells don't destroy the figments created by the mirror image spell, but targeted spells do. To determine if a spell is "targeted" look at the information that proceeds each spell description. If there is a Target or Targets entry, the spell is targeted."

Finger of Death:
Target: One living creature

Magic Missile:
Targets: Up to five creatures, no two of which can be more than 15 ft. apart

Shocking Grasp:
Target: Creature or object touched

I fail to see the difference.

Yea, that's what I thought after the game with the chance to flip thru both spell descriptions, and the target text... *shrugs* Oh well, I'll call it differently next time. Thanks for the feedback, folks.

 

[Uller]

The general consensus, and the intention of the spell, is that it only protects from attacks made with an attack roll.

I don't think that is the "consensus" of these boards or intention of the spell. If something is the least bit vague, you will not have a consensus on these boards...see the thread on Mirror Images and Flanking for an example.

Call it rule-0. Call it vague description by WotC. But if you allow it to stop Finger of Death (or similar things) it becomes to powerful.

Yeah, except that the attacker can clearly see that mirror image is in effect and can easily defeat it. If a spell caster casts a powerful targeted spell at an enemy who is clearly under the influence of mirror image, then that spell caster has no business wielding high level magic. He might hurt himself...

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Yeah, except that the attacker can clearly see that mirror image is in effect and can easily defeat it. If a spell caster casts a powerful targeted spell at an enemy who is clearly under the influence of mirror image, then that spell caster has no business wielding high level magic. He might hurt himself...

Good point. Provided you rule that MI helps against Finger of Death (and similar Stuff) in your campaign, all spellcasters would probably know it (or at least most, and almost all of high enough level to cast the finger) and would get rid of the effect first.

 

[Numion]

Aside from the shorter duration, the random chance that mirror image will offer no defense whatsoever, and the fact that it doesn't turn the spell back on its caster, I suppose that's true.

Oh, and the fact that things like blindfighting and true seeing don't help you against spell turning. Forgot about those.

Well ok, let's compare that to Displacement. It's a level higher and the caster can be targeted normally, plus it has a shorter duration. Miss change is normally less than that of mirror images.

 

[IceBear]

So, displacement sucks, that doesn't have anything to do with Mirror Image.

IceBear

 

[Pielorinho]

In a recent session, the PCs were fighting a demon with damage reduction and active mirror-images, and they didn't have weapons good enough to overcome the damage reduction. Their only chance was to hit it with a Dismissal spell.

Their tactic, then, was to attack over and over, in order to get rid of all the mirror images; as soon as they were gone, they'd hit it with the dismissal spell. But to do that, they had to get rid of the mirror images -- otherwise, they'd risk wasting the spell on a fake.

Mirror images are very easy to get rid of. It was kinda funny watching them attack, cheer when they hit a fake image, and curse when they inadvertantly hit the demon itself.

Compare to displacement, which is difficult to get rid of; I think mirror-image is properly leveled.

Daniel

 

[KarinsDad]

Well ok, let's compare that to Displacement. It's a level higher and the caster can be targeted normally, plus it has a shorter duration. Miss change is normally less than that of mirror images.

Ah, cool.

Numion is going to try to repeatedly illustrate that Mirror Image is more potent than higher level spells and we get to attempt to prove him wrong each time.

Sounds like fun!

The main advantages of Mirror Image over Displacement:

1) You have a miss chance on targeted spells with Mirror Image.

2) It also, on the surface, appears to have a better duration (1 minute per level as opposed to 1 round per level), but that is misleading since once the images are gone via attacks, they are gone.

The main advantages of Displacement over Mirror Image:

1) You do not know that someone is displaced (unless your DM is stupid and tells you), hence, you sometimes miss and don't know why.

2) Attacks do not lower the duration of the spell.

3) Attacks do not lower the protectiveness of the spell.

Mirror Image also has a protective advantage early on in a combat, but it loses this advantage quickly. Comparing 5 images (a reasonable average number for most levels) with Displacement yields:

1st hit: 17% 50%
2nd hit: 20% 50%
3rd hit: 25% 50%
4th hit: 33% 50%
5th hit: 50% 50%
6th hit: 100% 50%
7th hit: 100% 50%
etc.

Remember, the chance to hit an image is typically much better than your chance to hit the arcane caster.

For example, a human caster with Mage Armor, Shield spell, a DEX of 16 has an AC of 24. His images have an AC of 13.

So, the chart above is somewhat misleading since images will get hit nearly every attack whereas the caster will get hit with those same attacks a lot less often.

In other words, a lot of attacks that would have missed the caster anyway will still take out an image.

And, this is especially true at high level. You might get a few more images, but full round attacks or a bunch of Magic Missiles by opponents can often take out those images in a few rounds. Displacement, on the other hand, will protect you for an entire combat unless it is dispelled.


Conclusion: Mirror Image typically has a shorter duration. It typically only protects for the first two to four rounds that the caster is attacked. It is visible and hence draws attacks like flies (at least in my game). It is easier to get rid of. It's protective quality decreases over time.

On the opposite side of the coin, it protects against targeted spell attacks, but they too lower it's overall duration. It also protects to a greater degree for a short period of time.

 

[TiQuinn]

Also, Displacement can be cast on others as well as yourself, making it a bit more versatile than Mirror Image.

Aside from that, I don't see how comparing spells of differing effects and differing levels is going to prove.....well....what ARE we trying to prove? That Mirror Image is broken? And if it's broken, is it just broken against Finger of Death? Or is it only broken when compared to both Finger of Death and Displacement? What if I have Blink cast on me as well? Do the images and displacement blink as well? What if they're invisible? Do the displaced blinking images become invisible as well? Well.....it shouldn't matter. Cause after all Finger of Death, being a 6th level spell, should rightfully stop the invisible, blinkin, displacin, mirror imagin mage dead in his tracks.......right?

Right?

....I'm confused now......

Edit: BTW, I would say no, Finger of Death wouldn't work because the sum total of the level of spells cast on the character (Blink: 3rd, Displacement: 3rd, Invisibility: 2nd, and Mirror Image: 2nd) add up to more total spell levels than Finger of Death: 6th.

........cause that's really how we determine if something's balanced.

 

[Kershek]

Any caster worth his/her weight who has Finger of Death would either cast True Seeing or have an item with its effects to fool the low level sensory trickster spells like Invisibility and Mirror Image.

 

[godfear]

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