Dragonlance More DRAGONLANCE Information: Kender, Battles, W&H's Novels, & More!

In addition to the official videos announcing Dragonlance releases for late 2022, I got to talk to talk to the D&D team and get a few more details not in the public D&D Direct event.

• Because Dragonlance is a setting about war, Ray Winninger, Executive Producer of Dungeons & Dragons, was asked if Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen would have large-scale combat rules. He said that they would in an broad abstract form. The board game or battle game Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn is actually focused on large-scale combat and can be played independently or RPG players could switch to Warriors of Krynn for their big combat scenes, including porting in their characters and then switch back to the RPG after the battle. So the RPG adventure can be played alone, the board game can be played alone or they can be combined, depending upon the group's preference.
• Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn is a cooperative game.
• When asked if Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn could be used for large-scale battles in other D&D settings Winninger said it was designed with that idea in mind. However, if Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn is poplar they'll consider making more customized, large-scale combat board games for other settings.
• Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen is a brand new story, independent of the upcoming novel, Dragonlance: Dragons of Deceit. Winninger said that Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman are telling their own story set in Krynn while Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen is a different story set in Krynn and is blazing a trail to help players create their own stories in Krynn. So Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen and Dragons of Deceit are both set in the same world but different stories.
• There will be some cameos from old Dragonlance characters, especially villains, in Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen.
• Price points for Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn and Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen are not finalized yet.
• When asked about player races for Dragonlance: Shadow of the Dragon Queen – especially Kender – Winninger said that Kender have gotten a good reception from the Unearthed Arcana play test but they're making some tweaks. Yes, Kender will be an option. He said the play test material gives hints as to what playable races it will have but would not mention to confirm any specifically beyond Kender.

 

[Raunalyn]

What you're showing here is you misreading my comments (and indeed your "quote" there is the opposite of a quote lol) and interpreted them in an... idiosyncratic... way, when everyone else understood them correctly, rather than anything else.

You're acting like I said "Athasian Halflings and Kender are basically the same thing".

I would never say that.

Kender are far more disruptive and problematic than stone-age cannibal sociopaths.

Your actual quote: "wilder than halflings, fearless, sometimes cruel as only children can be"

My quote was from the Wikipedia that you, yourself, linked to. But again...you apparently have no interest in reasonable discussion, so I will stop the discussion with you right here.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Your actual quote: "wilder than halflings, fearless, sometimes cruel as only children can be"

Which itself from someone else, so why not use the quote? Why rephrase it? So confused but fine lol.

 

[Raunalyn]

Which itself from someone else, so why not use the quote? Why rephrase it? So confused but fine lol.

I quoted directly from the Wikipedia that you, yourself, linked. Why selectively quote only the part that "defended" your biased interpretation?

But yes, "fine lol"...

 

[Ruin Explorer]

I quoted directly from the Wikipedia that you, yourself, linked. Why selectively quote only the part that "defended" your biased interpretation?

But yes, "fine lol"...

Because you asked for the example... You can't ask for things then complain about getting them, you know? I even sourced it so you could read the context. Trying to make out I'm not being honest when I literally provided a link to the source so you could read is just shenanigans frankly.

 

[Raunalyn]

Because you asked for the example... You can't ask for things then complain about getting them, you know? I even sourced it so you could read the context. Trying to make out I'm not being honest when I literally provided a link to the source so you could read is just shenanigans frankly.

Yes...I asked for the quote from Hickman...not from Grubb. You would know this if you read the entire passage instead of cherry-picking your comment to confirm your bias. I had to point out the context.

I think this conversation is done. Thanks

 

[Neonchameleon]

Neither are 1e and 2e Kender. 3.5 Kenders? Yeah...did not like their write-up.

1e kender are the lying brats that sensible people know and detest. From War of the Lance page 51:

Even if caught red-handed while taking an item, the range of excuses a kender will offer is amazing: ​

"Guess I found it somewhere." ​

"I forgot that I had it." ​

"You walked off before I could give it back." ​

"I was afraid someone else would take it." ​

"You must have dropped it." ​

"You put it down and I didn't think you wanted it anymore." ​

"Maybe it fell into my pocket." ​

All of these lines are delivered with an innocent sincerity that is all the more maddening because the kender really is sincere[ A kender might not necessarily remember where he found something, even if he picked it up half a minute before, and such responses are often delivered as part of a subconscious defense mechanism. Intense curiosity is a trait ingrained in their souls and minds from their racial creation by the Greystone of Gargath. They cannot be other than what they are-- natural thieves.​

​

On the other hand, kender, like everyone else, do not like the idea of someone delibeately taking an item from someone else with- out the latter's permission. To be called a thief is still considered a base insult. This assertion sounds remarkable in view of the fact that kender constantly borrow things from each other and from visitors (without asking) in their communities. Kender don't regard their idea of borrowing as stealing, however. If they need something, they'll take it. If they see something interesting, they'll pick it up and pocket it.​

In short 1e Kender are thieves who understand what thievery is but the spoiled brats are going to get very very upset if you actually use the correct description of what they do. We mustn't offend them or their feelings will be hurt. (And exactly the same nonsense was there in Tales of the Lance except they had a cutesy name and some spurious justifications about how "Handling" wasn't Thieving - but they would still lie about taking things and didn't understand property ownership anyway (which would cause them to have no need to lie)). 2e kender as far as I know only appear in the Complete Book of Halflings & Gnomes and barely get any text.

The only difference I see between 1e Kender and 3.5e kender is that 3.5 is very slightly more explicit about exactly the same traits.

 

[Raunalyn]

In short 1e Kender are thieves who understand what thievery is but the spoiled brats are going to get very very upset if you actually use the correct description of what they do.

You quoted a relevant passage that actually contradicts your assessment.
"Kender don't regard their idea of borrowing as stealing, however. If they need something, they'll take it. If they see something interesting, they'll pick it up and pocket it."

They don't understand that it is thievery.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

You quoted a relevant passage that actually contradicts your assessment.
"Kender don't regard their idea of borrowing as stealing, however. If they need something, they'll take it. If they see something interesting, they'll pick it up and pocket it."

They don't understand that it is thievery.

But they also do. Hence the lying. If they genuinely didn't understand, they wouldn't feel the need to lie.

We could investigate this in some depth, about how maybe they have a "split mind" or something, a subconscious that knows they're thieves, and a conscious that doesn't, but whatever the end result is that they're disruptive thieves who can potentially spur inter-party conflict, or even get the entire party arrested.

Again, the whole thing is based on badly-behaved children, who absolutely do stuff like this.

 

[Neonchameleon]

You quoted a relevant passage that actually contradicts your assessment.
"Kender don't regard their idea of borrowing as stealing, however. If they need something, they'll take it. If they see something interesting, they'll pick it up and pocket it."

They don't understand that it is thievery.

Except that that explanation doesn't hold water.

1. If kender didn't know that it was wrong they wouldn't bother to lie about it.
2. Kender might not think that it is stealing per se. But if they weren't terminally self-centered they would learn after about the second time that their supposed friends really do not like them doing that so they would stop doing it. That they continue to do so anyway shows that they do not give a flying naughty word what their supposed friends think. They are truly, deeply selfish not willing to give up a little momentary pleasure to avoid upsetting their friends by stealing from them again.

 

[Raunalyn]

But they also do. Hence the lying. If they genuinely didn't understand, they wouldn't feel the need to lie.

We could investigate this in some depth, about how maybe they have a "split mind" or something, a subconscious that knows they're thieves, and a conscious that doesn't, but whatever the end result is that they're disruptive thieves who can potentially spur inter-party conflict, or even get the entire party arrested.

Again, the whole thing is based on badly-behaved children, who absolutely do stuff like this.

And once again, easily managed if you set clear expectations to your players as a DM.