D&D General [+] More Robust 'Fantasy Race' Mechanics for D&D-alikes / Redeeming 'Race as Class' for Modern D&D [+]

[Micah Sweet]

If classes are going to grant abilities just about every level, then I think race should do something similar as well. I'd advocate for 1st/3rd/5th/7th/9th (or 1st/5th/9th) abilities myself. And preferably not "+1 to X stat".

1E and 2E didn't really need this sort of thing as there were no decision points during leveling, and other than spellcasters very few classes gained new abilities at level up - beyond better THAC0, hp & saves.

One of the things I've done with races in my 5E Frankenstein is:

Dwarves: If you choose a class/subclass that doesn't cast spells, you get Magic Resistance
Halflings: If you choose to take a -1 to Strength, you get a free Dex-based skill proficiency and PB advantage on Dex skill checks per day.
Elves: A feat that allows you to use Trance to change one skill Proficiency during a long rest.

And so on.

Level Up has packages of abilities for heritage. Two are chosen at first level, and the third comes in at tenth ("paragon" level). Each package provides options, so you can tailor your PC.

 

[TwoSix]

If classes are going to grant abilities just about every level, then I think race should do something similar as well. I'd advocate for 1st/3rd/5th/7th/9th (or 1st/5th/9th) abilities myself. And preferably not "+1 to X stat".

1E and 2E didn't really need this sort of thing as there were no decision points during leveling, and other than spellcasters very few classes gained new abilities at level up - beyond better THAC0, hp & saves.

One of the things I've done with races in my 5E Frankenstein is:

Dwarves: If you choose a class/subclass that doesn't cast spells, you get Magic Resistance
Halflings: If you choose to take a -1 to Strength, you get a free Dex-based skill proficiency and PB advantage on Dex skill checks per day.
Elves: A feat that allows you to use Trance to change one skill Proficiency during a long rest.

And so on.

One idea I've toyed with over the years is for a system where every character makes two major selections; their race, which grants them an ability at every odd level, and class, which gives them an ability at every even level.

Some ancestries have strong, locked in abilities that really synergize with very specific class abilities, such that not taking that class would be a major detriment. Other races have abilities that are more versatile. And a human's special racial ability is that they can multiclass, selecting a second class's abilities in their racial slots.

 

[Lanefan]

True enough.

Though D&D has never or rarely claimed to be a generic or universal RPG. It has attempted to cover a wide variety of settings, but a certain amount of setting expectation has often been baked into it, and explicitly so, from the start. Vance-style magic, for example. Clerics not being able to wield pointed or edged weapons. Demi-humans having class limitations and level limits (which Gary talked about in the first DMG, and Zeb did in the 2E one as being to ensure the primacy of humans in most settings), the existence of Aragorn-clone Rangers who get damage bonuses against certain monsters...

WotC-era D&D removed some of those elements (like race limitations on class and level), and made the game more generic in terms of what kinds of fantasy settings it can accomodate, but not all of them.


That's an interesting idea. Like B/X but with more classes. Humans get the Core Four (plus maybe Monk? How about Barbarian or Paladin?), demi-humans get the rest. In 5E this would be tricky, though, because 12 classes but 10 species.

Cleric: Human
Fighter: Human
Rogue: Human
Wizard: Human

Barbarian: Goliath, Orc
Bard: Halfling, Gnome
Druid: Aasimar, Elf,
Monk: Goliath, Gnome
Paladin: Aasimar, Dragonborn, Dwarf, Tiefling
Ranger: Halfling, Elf
Sorcerer: Dragonborn, Dwarf
Warlock: Tiefling, Orc

I think most folks want more options than this, but it's a fun notion to play around with.

I was thinking of a slightly more open set of choices; almost any species can be the core four plus some other options but Humans are limited to just the core four. So, the class options list by species might look more like:

Human - CFRW only
Orc - CFRW Barbarian Monk Warlock
Gnome - CFRW Illusionist Sorcerer Warlock Bard
Elf - any
Dwarf - CFR Barbarian Bard Paladin Ranger (if you don't want Dwarven arcanists, say)
etc.

Overall I think it's going a bit backwards, in that I think better design for most folks is to try to make the species balanced against each other and likewise with the classes. And that's complicated somewhat by siloing the options like this.

But it's an interesting way to examine how a setting could be embodied more in the options. In the above example schema, for example, maybe Paladins are all knights of particular kingdoms or deities associated with those species.

 

[Tesral]

I think anything along that line should be campaign specific. The game itself should be as open as possible. In my own world Centaurs don't train as Rouges, doesn't mean that can't try, but the species itself is anti stealthy.

I have a different method for balancing the clearly unbalanced races (Like Centaurs) Racial hit dice are just hit dice. They count as levels. Second there is an experience rider, difficulty depending on how unbalanced you are. It makes some of my more exotic custom races playable without owning the whole game.

 

[Lanefan]

I think anything along that line should be campaign specific. The game itself should be as open as possible. In my own world Centaurs don't train as Rouges, doesn't mean that can't try, but the species itself is anti stealthy.

Makes sense.

I have a different method for balancing the clearly unbalanced races (Like Centaurs) Racial hit dice are just hit dice. They count as levels.

I did the same thing when someone once - via some lucky reincarnation rolling - brought a Centaur into my game. Its 4 hit dice became 4 levels of Fighter, which was a perfect fit for the party's level at the time.

Had that happened when the party was only 1st level, I'd have said the now-Centaur character would have to go on hold until the party more or less caught up, and the player would need to roll up something new in the meantime.

 

[Mannahnin]

I was thinking of a slightly more open set of choices; almost any species can be the core four plus some other options but Humans are limited to just the core four. So, the class options list by species might look more like:

Human - CFRW only
Orc - CFRW Barbarian Monk Warlock
Gnome - CFRW Illusionist Sorcerer Warlock Bard
Elf - any
Dwarf - CFR Barbarian Bard Paladin Ranger (if you don't want Dwarven arcanists, say)
etc.

Ok, but then do the humans get to just be BETTER than everyone else in trade for their limited class selection? And if so, does that mean the core four classes have to be weaker in trade? If so, of course, no one else will want to be one.

 

[TwoSix]

Another idea I've tossed around is using B/X style race-as-class combined with robust AD&D style multiclassing. So if you want to be an elf, at least one of your classes must be Elf. But you can be an Elf, or an Elf/Fighter, or an Elf/Ranger/Cleric if that's your preference.

Human's big advantage is that they can focus on just their chosen class without the XP lag of having to level up a multiclass.

If the table wants, they can tweak the allowed multiclass list to further define the individual races.

 

[Tesral]

Another idea I've tossed around is using B/X style race-as-class combined with robust AD&D style multiclassing. So if you want to be an elf, at least one of your classes must be Elf. But you can be an Elf, or an Elf/Fighter, or an Elf/Ranger/Cleric if that's your preference.

Human's big advantage is that they can focus on just their chosen class without the XP lag of having to level up a multiclass.

If the table wants, they can tweak the allowed multiclass list to further define the individual races.

This is still hobbling everyone else to make Humans look good. Why is a floating stat bump and and extra skill point not enough?

But then I don't see Humans as the golden children that must be the best. I try to keep any race from becoming the game Mary Sue.

I can deal with Dwarven wizards and Elven berserkers. I want to be open to your character concept without the rules strangling it.

 

[TwoSix]

This is still hobbling everyone else to make Humans look good. Why is a floating stat bump and and extra skill point not enough?

I mean, I think for a lot of people interested in these concepts, reinforcing humanocentrism is one of the points of play.

I'm interested in concepts in the OSR space that try to split the difference; humans have an advantage in class versatility but other ancestries have unique advantages to compensate.

The main point of race-as-class is to reinforce ancestry tropes; if you want those tropes to be more in the background and every character has a wide variety of concepts available, then this ideas probably won't appeal to you.

 

[Tesral]

I mean, I think for a lot of people interested in these concepts, reinforcing humanocentrism is one of the points of play.

I'm interested in concepts in the OSR space that try to split the difference; humans have an advantage in class versatility but other ancestries have unique advantages to compensate.

The main point of race-as-class is to reinforce ancestry tropes; if you want those tropes to be more in the background and every character has a wide variety of concepts available, then this ideas probably won't appeal to you.

If you truly want Humans to be the golden child stop beating around and DO it. Give them obvious advantages instead of making all the other races play in the cruel shoes. That is my main objection is that Humans are not actually better, everyone else is worse. This does however follow the trope of D&D being a No system.