Most broken prestige classes?

[wildstarsreach]

I think that you will find that Radiant servant of Pelor is getting lots of votes.

Asmo

That is because he out clerics the Cleric.

 

[Doctor DM]

Yeah, most have allready been mentioned, but no one's said anything about the Sacred Fist from Complete Divine.

It's not THAT bad, but take a look at it. The big problem to me is the Fighter base atk bonus. By taking one level of cleric and then SF, you get spell progresion (almost) every level, you keep advancing with monk unarmed damage, speed and AC, AND your BAB improves. (not to mention a few other VERY nice abilities).

I have no clue why you wouldn't just keep the monk/cleric base atk bonus...

 

[DreadArchon]

That means the multiclassing doesn't help you at all (since you only take the FL class from hereon)

Unless you chose to multiclass poorly to get into FL. I don't think I would, but it is a possibility.

and the metal armor restriction does apply for your first ten levels.

Not if you take Druid as your tenth level. Also, the Bard levels make it advantageous to wear light armor anyway, which limits the relevance of the metal restrictions.

and end up with a char that's not stronger than any singleclass druid.

Erm, what is stronger than a singleclass druid?

Even the abusive build on the wizards char optimisation board is pretty... lame. Compared to the other classes listed here.

That's why I was arguing against the FL being broken.

The only thing that does bother me about the FL is that the single dip level into Druid gets you Predator Form if you go for Shapeshift. Considering that the Predator Form will give the Dwarf +30 to land speed whenever he wants it (and the ability to use Druid scrolls when not a predator), that's a pretty good dip level. Still, he loses his gear and some Warlock powers while shifted, so... meh.

 

[Mistwell]

RSoP is Cleric+. It's almost exactly like the base cleric, just with a lower HD size, but with added benefits that increase the usefulness of what the cleric is already good at. If you were going to pick the Sun domain anyway, which is by no means out of the question, what do you have to lose? A couple skill points allocated differently than you might have otherwise done? Big deal. You're a Cleric+!

You are ignoring the lack of choices this prestige class forces on you - and that IS a significant thing to give up.

Your domains are fixed to Sun and Healing, if you want to use all the abilities of the prestige class. And the healing domain is awful. Even WOTC admits the healing domain is really really lame for the cleric. Almost nobody would choose that domain unless forced to do so. Heck, the second level power of this prestige class should probably itself be the granted power of the healing domain just to give people an incentive to take it in the first place. That is a drawback.

Extra turning is not a great feat on it's own. If a cleric were to take it, it is almost always because they need it to power some other feat they are planned on choosing. That is also a drawback.

5 ranks in healing and 9 in knowledge religion is also a drawback. Intelligence is a dump stat for most Clerics, and they only get 2 skill points per level. That means devoting most of your skill points to those two relatively weak skills for about a quarter of your adventuring career.

Taking this prestige class does in fact have significant drawbacks, because it takes away options from you and makes you take options that are well known for being sub-optimal. I really wish people would stop calling this prestige class "Cleric+". It just isn't that. Normal clerics have more choices than this particular kind of cleric, and this game is often about choices and having your options open to go in different directions.

 

[Darklone]

5 ranks of Heal is pretty ridiculous. I've never seen a cleric run out of heal spells... cure minor wounds is like a Heal check to stabilize, only better, and 0 level spells are like candy. If you don't have a decent Int, you could end up spending half your skill points on this skill. Obviously, humans and gray elves don't have it so bad.

You've never seen a cleric run out of heal spells? Cure spells even. My last big group had two nearly singleclass clerics, a psion, two druids and two multiclass chars who could use wands of cure light wounds (ranger and paladin levels). And yet about every third gaming session, the whole group was out of cure spells. YMMV, my battles are bloody.

Unless you chose to multiclass poorly to get into FL. I don't think I would, but it is a possibility.

I can hardly imagine any reason why you shouldn't take the class as soon as you can get into it...

Not if you take Druid as your tenth level. Also, the Bard levels make it advantageous to wear light armor anyway, which limits the relevance of the metal restrictions.

Right, sorry. I was assuming most FL builds take more than one level of druid since the druids spellcasting is lots stronger.

Erm, what is stronger than a singleclass druid?

Two singleclass druids ?

The only thing that does bother me about the FL is that the single dip level into Druid gets you Predator Form if you go for Shapeshift. Considering that the Predator Form will give the Dwarf +30 to land speed whenever he wants it (and the ability to use Druid scrolls when not a predator), that's a pretty good dip level. Still, he loses his gear and some Warlock powers while shifted, so... meh.

Predator form was what and where from? Dwarven FLs... argh. These give me the shivers.

 

[Someone]

If the Radiant Servant is better at healing and turning than a regular cleric, does it make the class broken? He's specializing quite heavily to enter the class in terms of skills and domains. It's like calling the Invisible blade broken because it's better at dagger fighting than a rogue, or the dwarven defender because is more resilient than a fighter.

 

[Fieari]

Alright. Let's at least start from this premise. Assuming that A) You were going to pick the Sun Domain anyway, and B) The game starts at ECL 11, why would you want to go straight cleric 11 instead of Cleric 6/RSoP 5?

Note that RSoP 5 gives you an extra domain, meaning that you're no longer stuck with the suboptimal healing domain. You gain better turning abilities, better light spells, weapon proficiency, magical disease immunity, better healing, and even better will saves, and better will saves for the entire party too. Furthermore, you gain everything a cleric would for each level, except a single point of HP per level (on average).

I'll grant that up until ECL 11, the healing domain is suboptimal, but can you accept that after ECL 11, it's been more than made up for? Far more than made up for?

 

[Slaved]

Looking at the Radiant servant you do not have to pick up the healing domain at all. It does not look like it even says that you only gain the empower and maximize benefits from a healing spell cast from the domain slot.

Even if it did require that though the character could have the Sun domain and any other he likes and pick up the healing domain directly from the class itself.

The cleric is already incredibly strong. This prestige class does indeed look like cleric+.

 

[Votan]

Or you can realize that by the time a Warmage gets access to the cleric spell list Wizards have had that access with limited wish for three levels, and that if you are going to ask a pure caster to fall two spell levels behind to get something it had better be very good.

Agreed. If you use the table then you should go with the liberal interpretation of cleric spell addition. On the other hand, a more restrictive version makes sense if you accept the full caster progression.

 

[Legildur]

We have two straight clerics (and one multi-classed cleric) in our World's Largest Dungeon campaign (and boy, do we need it!). Both of these are aiming for RSoP. One is already there. The healing capabilities are fantastic. One has also focused on turning undead... and he can smash (low-level) undead by the dozen. Definately a cleric+. But broken? I don't think so, but we are still relatively low level (7-8th).